<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
	
	>
<channel>
	<title>
	Comments on: Asilomar #3: Green Knowledge	</title>
	<atom:link href="/2007/asilomar-3-green-knowledge/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>/2007/asilomar-3-green-knowledge/</link>
	<description>less helpful</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 23 Dec 2008 21:36:52 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>
	hourly	</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>
	1	</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>https://wordpress.org/?v=6.8.2</generator>
	<item>
		<title>
		By: dy/dan &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Asilomar #7: A Complete, Balanced Curriculum		</title>
		<link>/2007/asilomar-3-green-knowledge/#comment-195573</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dy/dan &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Asilomar #7: A Complete, Balanced Curriculum]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Dec 2008 02:18:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=514#comment-195573</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[...] Overhead transparencies. Like last time. [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] Overhead transparencies. Like last time. [&#8230;]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: dan		</title>
		<link>/2007/asilomar-3-green-knowledge/#comment-193453</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 14:20:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=514#comment-193453</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I don&#039;t know if I can wring my hands too much over our grading culture, but I do agree that students who have made smartness and quickness a part of their self-assessment do not tolerate challenges to those beliefs.  They don&#039;t appreciate a difficult problem that takes several wrong approaches before the right one reveals itself.

The only solution, I think, is to keep issuing those challenges until, by the second term, no one thinks any less of them and everyone is comfortable with failure, even the kids who never fail.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know if I can wring my hands too much over our grading culture, but I do agree that students who have made smartness and quickness a part of their self-assessment do not tolerate challenges to those beliefs.  They don&#8217;t appreciate a difficult problem that takes several wrong approaches before the right one reveals itself.</p>
<p>The only solution, I think, is to keep issuing those challenges until, by the second term, no one thinks any less of them and everyone is comfortable with failure, even the kids who never fail.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: MrTeach		</title>
		<link>/2007/asilomar-3-green-knowledge/#comment-193366</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[MrTeach]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 02:10:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=514#comment-193366</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Dan,

I just wrote a post concerning two activities we did in class today.  In my mind, both leaned to the &quot;green knowlege&quot; side of the spectrum.  What absolutely shocked me in the two activities was the reaction of two of my most intelligent students.  They HATED the activities.  They weren&#039;t comfortable with the trial and error involved in the two games.

Now, I understand high achieving students like being successful.  Most of the time this success comes easy to the intelligent students.  Today, it took a little work.  This took some being wrong.  Has our emphasis on grades (even in elementary school where grades are more or less determined on whether or not a student turned in their work) ruined the students of even attempting to answer a problem where they might be wrong?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dan,</p>
<p>I just wrote a post concerning two activities we did in class today.  In my mind, both leaned to the &#8220;green knowlege&#8221; side of the spectrum.  What absolutely shocked me in the two activities was the reaction of two of my most intelligent students.  They HATED the activities.  They weren&#8217;t comfortable with the trial and error involved in the two games.</p>
<p>Now, I understand high achieving students like being successful.  Most of the time this success comes easy to the intelligent students.  Today, it took a little work.  This took some being wrong.  Has our emphasis on grades (even in elementary school where grades are more or less determined on whether or not a student turned in their work) ruined the students of even attempting to answer a problem where they might be wrong?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: Mr. Teach		</title>
		<link>/2007/asilomar-3-green-knowledge/#comment-193365</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mr. Teach]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 01:51:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=514#comment-193365</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[...] After seeing their disgusted reaction with this activity, I couldn&#8217;t help but think of the Red/Green Knowledge post from dy/dan.Â  These two students are red knowledge All-Stars.Â  Some of my lower achieving [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] After seeing their disgusted reaction with this activity, I couldn&#8217;t help but think of the Red/Green Knowledge post from dy/dan.Â  These two students are red knowledge All-Stars.Â  Some of my lower achieving [&#8230;]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: H.		</title>
		<link>/2007/asilomar-3-green-knowledge/#comment-38756</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[H.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Dec 2007 03:05:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=514#comment-38756</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Dan, I have given up on reading some high-volume blogs, but those had texts where it was necessary to read a paragraph or two to find out whether the rest was worth looking at, or where the ratio of ideas to text was low. Not an issue here.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dan, I have given up on reading some high-volume blogs, but those had texts where it was necessary to read a paragraph or two to find out whether the rest was worth looking at, or where the ratio of ideas to text was low. Not an issue here.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: Eric Hoefler		</title>
		<link>/2007/asilomar-3-green-knowledge/#comment-38699</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Eric Hoefler]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Dec 2007 19:23:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=514#comment-38699</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[While I agree that &quot;green knowledge&quot; &lt;em&gt;can&lt;/em&gt; be tested on multiple-choice tests, it too often is not and is not really designed to do so (so why force it?).

Also, not all types of &quot;green knowledge&quot; can be tested this way.  You cannot design a multiple-choice test that can effectively evaluate a student&#039;s ability to write.  For that matter, a multiple-choice test will never tell you whether or not a student &quot;knows&quot; how to swim ... only the lake will prove that.

If we make a distinction between &quot;knowing&quot; and &quot;doing&quot; (i.e., knowledge and skills), then I think we just push the issue further back.  If I answer all the right questions about swimming, but can&#039;t actually do it, do I &quot;know&quot; it?  And which part of that is red vs. green?  Isn&#039;t it more effective to just ask me to swim?  And how do you get at my cognitive abilities if all I have to do is select someone else&#039;s cognitive conclusions from a list?

But I agree with your last point: more focus on &quot;green knowledge&quot; can&#039;t help but spill over into improved testing of &quot;red knowledge.&quot;

[And, to repeat what I&#039;ve said elsewhere, I&#039;m not against red knowledge or the testing of it through multiple choice tests.  I&#039;m against seeing both as the definitive assessment of a student&#039;s education and of the educational system as a whole ... which is the generic public view.]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While I agree that &#8220;green knowledge&#8221; <em>can</em> be tested on multiple-choice tests, it too often is not and is not really designed to do so (so why force it?).</p>
<p>Also, not all types of &#8220;green knowledge&#8221; can be tested this way.  You cannot design a multiple-choice test that can effectively evaluate a student&#8217;s ability to write.  For that matter, a multiple-choice test will never tell you whether or not a student &#8220;knows&#8221; how to swim &#8230; only the lake will prove that.</p>
<p>If we make a distinction between &#8220;knowing&#8221; and &#8220;doing&#8221; (i.e., knowledge and skills), then I think we just push the issue further back.  If I answer all the right questions about swimming, but can&#8217;t actually do it, do I &#8220;know&#8221; it?  And which part of that is red vs. green?  Isn&#8217;t it more effective to just ask me to swim?  And how do you get at my cognitive abilities if all I have to do is select someone else&#8217;s cognitive conclusions from a list?</p>
<p>But I agree with your last point: more focus on &#8220;green knowledge&#8221; can&#8217;t help but spill over into improved testing of &#8220;red knowledge.&#8221;</p>
<p>[And, to repeat what I&#8217;ve said elsewhere, I&#8217;m not against red knowledge or the testing of it through multiple choice tests.  I&#8217;m against seeing both as the definitive assessment of a student&#8217;s education and of the educational system as a whole &#8230; which is the generic public view.]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: dan		</title>
		<link>/2007/asilomar-3-green-knowledge/#comment-38696</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Dec 2007 18:21:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=514#comment-38696</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;strong&gt;Eric&lt;/strong&gt;, strong second point.  Introspection is the bridge between your world and mine.

I&#039;m conflicted on your first point, though.  It &lt;em&gt;is&lt;/em&gt; possible to test green knowledge through multiple choice examinations.  California does.

I think the gravitational pull of standardized testing though is toward red knowledge, which is unfortunate.  I think if I taught more green knowledge my students would do better on these exams &#039;cause they wouldn&#039;t shut down on problems whose solutions weren&#039;t immediately apparent.

&lt;strong&gt;H.&lt;/strong&gt;, thanks for the positive feedback.  When Richardson &lt;a href=&quot;http://weblogg-ed.com/2007/reading-ideas-instead-of-people-take-22/&quot;&gt;says&lt;/a&gt; that he doesn&#039;t read people who post too much, I get all self-conscious about my post volume.  And sorry, haven&#039;t seen a camera yet.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Eric</strong>, strong second point.  Introspection is the bridge between your world and mine.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m conflicted on your first point, though.  It <em>is</em> possible to test green knowledge through multiple choice examinations.  California does.</p>
<p>I think the gravitational pull of standardized testing though is toward red knowledge, which is unfortunate.  I think if I taught more green knowledge my students would do better on these exams &#8217;cause they wouldn&#8217;t shut down on problems whose solutions weren&#8217;t immediately apparent.</p>
<p><strong>H.</strong>, thanks for the positive feedback.  When Richardson <a href="http://weblogg-ed.com/2007/reading-ideas-instead-of-people-take-22/">says</a> that he doesn&#8217;t read people who post too much, I get all self-conscious about my post volume.  And sorry, haven&#8217;t seen a camera yet.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: H.		</title>
		<link>/2007/asilomar-3-green-knowledge/#comment-38694</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[H.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Dec 2007 18:13:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=514#comment-38694</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Are any of these sessions videotaped?

Anyway, thanks for writing these great summaries! I may need to look up some writings by this Mr. Sallee.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Are any of these sessions videotaped?</p>
<p>Anyway, thanks for writing these great summaries! I may need to look up some writings by this Mr. Sallee.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: Eric Hoefler		</title>
		<link>/2007/asilomar-3-green-knowledge/#comment-38690</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Eric Hoefler]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Dec 2007 17:24:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=514#comment-38690</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Nice post, Dan.

This distinction, and its importance, is THE main problem I have with the over-reliance on standardized tests.  Typical multiple-choice testing does little to nothing to encourage (to say nothing of &quot;help to assess&quot;) whether any &quot;green knowledge&quot; has been mastered by the student.

This distinction is also a helpful doorway, I think, for bringing writing and reflection into the math classroom.  (Same could be said for other disciplines that are not traditionally writing-centered.)]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice post, Dan.</p>
<p>This distinction, and its importance, is THE main problem I have with the over-reliance on standardized tests.  Typical multiple-choice testing does little to nothing to encourage (to say nothing of &#8220;help to assess&#8221;) whether any &#8220;green knowledge&#8221; has been mastered by the student.</p>
<p>This distinction is also a helpful doorway, I think, for bringing writing and reflection into the math classroom.  (Same could be said for other disciplines that are not traditionally writing-centered.)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
		
			</item>
	</channel>
</rss>
