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	Comments on: How Do You Solve A Problem Like TMAO?	</title>
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	<description>less helpful</description>
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		<title>
		By: Crimson Wife		</title>
		<link>/2008/how-do-you-solve-a-problem-like-tmao/#comment-115365</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Crimson Wife]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 01:52:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=829#comment-115365</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[The lack of a career progression in classroom teaching I believe does discourage people from entering the profession at the K-12 level and hurts retention. If I&#039;m a bright and ambitious would-be teacher, college-level teaching with its career ladder (associate professor, full prof, subdepartment head, department head) is going to be much more attractive. Obviously there are other reasons why someone might prefer teaching at the college level- higher pay, much greater autonomy, better physical surroundings, students who are in the classroom of their own volition rather than by force of law, etc. But I think the flat structure definitely makes K-12 teaching less attractive a profession.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The lack of a career progression in classroom teaching I believe does discourage people from entering the profession at the K-12 level and hurts retention. If I&#8217;m a bright and ambitious would-be teacher, college-level teaching with its career ladder (associate professor, full prof, subdepartment head, department head) is going to be much more attractive. Obviously there are other reasons why someone might prefer teaching at the college level- higher pay, much greater autonomy, better physical surroundings, students who are in the classroom of their own volition rather than by force of law, etc. But I think the flat structure definitely makes K-12 teaching less attractive a profession.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Scott McLeod		</title>
		<link>/2008/how-do-you-solve-a-problem-like-tmao/#comment-112761</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Scott McLeod]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Jun 2008 06:33:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=829#comment-112761</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[No, Chris, I disagree. I say he comes to ISU and gets his degree in school leadership and then takes on the challenge on making it happen school-wide - the challenge of BEING the principal he wants...   =)]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, Chris, I disagree. I say he comes to ISU and gets his degree in school leadership and then takes on the challenge on making it happen school-wide &#8211; the challenge of BEING the principal he wants&#8230;   =)</p>
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		<title>
		By: Chris Lehmann		</title>
		<link>/2008/how-do-you-solve-a-problem-like-tmao/#comment-110882</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chris Lehmann]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 23:56:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=829#comment-110882</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I say he comes and teaches at SLA, where we believe in educational innovation *and* innovative implementation. 

We look to get better every day, and then we look to share our best practice with anyone who reads our blogs, comes to visit, comes to EduCon, etc... 

Tom&#039;s right -- we need schools that work, that see themselves as incubators of ideas, etc.. .and we need more and more and more of them.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I say he comes and teaches at SLA, where we believe in educational innovation *and* innovative implementation. </p>
<p>We look to get better every day, and then we look to share our best practice with anyone who reads our blogs, comes to visit, comes to EduCon, etc&#8230; </p>
<p>Tom&#8217;s right &#8212; we need schools that work, that see themselves as incubators of ideas, etc.. .and we need more and more and more of them.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Tom Hoffman		</title>
		<link>/2008/how-do-you-solve-a-problem-like-tmao/#comment-110695</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tom Hoffman]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 15:46:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=829#comment-110695</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[What I&#039;m trying to critique is the idea that if there were some kind of non-administrative career ladder for teachers that it would solve a significant part of the retention problem.  This was the original question, I believe.

To be sure, I think having master teachers mentor rookies is important, but on its own merits, not to make the master teachers feel better about their career.  

What a teacher needs is a well run school that gives them a real voice and role in the school as a whole.  It&#039;s the most you can give them, and if it isn&#039;t enough, well, they aren&#039;t bad people, but they just aren&#039;t going to be long haul teachers.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What I&#8217;m trying to critique is the idea that if there were some kind of non-administrative career ladder for teachers that it would solve a significant part of the retention problem.  This was the original question, I believe.</p>
<p>To be sure, I think having master teachers mentor rookies is important, but on its own merits, not to make the master teachers feel better about their career.  </p>
<p>What a teacher needs is a well run school that gives them a real voice and role in the school as a whole.  It&#8217;s the most you can give them, and if it isn&#8217;t enough, well, they aren&#8217;t bad people, but they just aren&#8217;t going to be long haul teachers.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Paul B		</title>
		<link>/2008/how-do-you-solve-a-problem-like-tmao/#comment-110435</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Paul B]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 10:41:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=829#comment-110435</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[My career prior to teaching was in technology in everything from startups to Fortune 50 and in that world I always noted that the organizations with the highest levels of innovation had the most chaotic organization charts. On the other side of that coin, the companies with low innovation had very stable, formal, symmetric org charts.

Public education is organized (at the point of delivery) as a very flat, stable, formal, symmetric organization. In most schools there is a principal/VP and then &#039;everybody else&#039;. There might be a department head or two but generally these are found in high schools not in lower grades.

Here&#039;s a short list of the various skillsets you might expect to find in a math teacher: Scriptwriter, Director, Entertainer, Mathematician, Curriculum Expert, Behavorial Expert, 
Analyst, Clerk, Linguist, Cognitive Expert, Technology Expert, Custodian, Decorator. Now in an innovative tech company you would find formal and informal organizational structures that criss-cross the skillsets like silly string. In education what you find is boxes (classrooms) filled with &#039;teachers&#039;. You find recruitment of &#039;math teacher&#039;, &#039;ela teacher&#039;, etc. No skill distinctions are made in recruitment because every one is (unrealistically) expected to have and love the whole enchilada.

People evolve, and in innovative organizations, managers provide the stimulus and ecosystem to take advantage of the evolving skillsets and interests in order to leverage (as much as possible) every single person. The side effect of this managerial style is that people can move to, or create the kinds of jobs they love. 

In public ed it&#039;s just the box. If script writing is what floats your boat and you&#039;re really good at it, there is no structure that enables you to leverage that work product across the organization. Each box sort of drifts into a comfort zone, if you&#039;re so inclined, or a discomfort zone, if you&#039;re an eagle.

TMAO is an eagle in a box!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My career prior to teaching was in technology in everything from startups to Fortune 50 and in that world I always noted that the organizations with the highest levels of innovation had the most chaotic organization charts. On the other side of that coin, the companies with low innovation had very stable, formal, symmetric org charts.</p>
<p>Public education is organized (at the point of delivery) as a very flat, stable, formal, symmetric organization. In most schools there is a principal/VP and then &#8216;everybody else&#8217;. There might be a department head or two but generally these are found in high schools not in lower grades.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s a short list of the various skillsets you might expect to find in a math teacher: Scriptwriter, Director, Entertainer, Mathematician, Curriculum Expert, Behavorial Expert,<br />
Analyst, Clerk, Linguist, Cognitive Expert, Technology Expert, Custodian, Decorator. Now in an innovative tech company you would find formal and informal organizational structures that criss-cross the skillsets like silly string. In education what you find is boxes (classrooms) filled with &#8216;teachers&#8217;. You find recruitment of &#8216;math teacher&#8217;, &#8216;ela teacher&#8217;, etc. No skill distinctions are made in recruitment because every one is (unrealistically) expected to have and love the whole enchilada.</p>
<p>People evolve, and in innovative organizations, managers provide the stimulus and ecosystem to take advantage of the evolving skillsets and interests in order to leverage (as much as possible) every single person. The side effect of this managerial style is that people can move to, or create the kinds of jobs they love. </p>
<p>In public ed it&#8217;s just the box. If script writing is what floats your boat and you&#8217;re really good at it, there is no structure that enables you to leverage that work product across the organization. Each box sort of drifts into a comfort zone, if you&#8217;re so inclined, or a discomfort zone, if you&#8217;re an eagle.</p>
<p>TMAO is an eagle in a box!</p>
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		<title>
		By: TMAO		</title>
		<link>/2008/how-do-you-solve-a-problem-like-tmao/#comment-110302</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[TMAO]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 05:48:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=829#comment-110302</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Man, not even my mom finds me this interesting...

I wish this was as simple as maybe it appears everyone who&#039;s not currently residing in my head. Take the first sentence Dan quoted: &quot;What gets me going is the pursuit of exponential student growth...&quot; and complicate with the fact that what makes me want to go after that exponential student growth is my passion for these kids, this community, and its trajectory into American history. And that passion is underwritten by all the amazing kids I&#039;ve met, their incredible families, the grit and guts I&#039;ve watched kids pour into trying to get over the wall erected by all kinds of inequity. It&#039;s never as simple as I-like-revising-my-lessons-more-than-I-like-teaching-them, even if I fail to accurately express that. 

But, but, but... being in it for the progress IS being in it for the kids. Why do we reduce the commitment to youth as being confined to really digging how funny they are, how they&#039;ve got this neat-o idiosyncracy? I don&#039;t know.

The idea of moving schools and kinda, like, starting over has (perhaps bizarrely) never appealed to me at all. It feels like the guy who hits .407 for a season, and decides to start over again the next year hitting from the opposite side of the plate. That&#039;s a challenge, sure, but why would you seek out that kind of challenge? Plus, I&#039;ve got this thing where if I&#039;m not teaching the poorest, darkest, most under-taught kids whose first-language is something other than English, I feel guilty and weak. Like, I feel bad about teaching in east San Jose sometimes, because I could probably find spots in Oakland and L.A. where shit is worse. Let&#039;s not even talk about this too much...]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Man, not even my mom finds me this interesting&#8230;</p>
<p>I wish this was as simple as maybe it appears everyone who&#8217;s not currently residing in my head. Take the first sentence Dan quoted: &#8220;What gets me going is the pursuit of exponential student growth&#8230;&#8221; and complicate with the fact that what makes me want to go after that exponential student growth is my passion for these kids, this community, and its trajectory into American history. And that passion is underwritten by all the amazing kids I&#8217;ve met, their incredible families, the grit and guts I&#8217;ve watched kids pour into trying to get over the wall erected by all kinds of inequity. It&#8217;s never as simple as I-like-revising-my-lessons-more-than-I-like-teaching-them, even if I fail to accurately express that. </p>
<p>But, but, but&#8230; being in it for the progress IS being in it for the kids. Why do we reduce the commitment to youth as being confined to really digging how funny they are, how they&#8217;ve got this neat-o idiosyncracy? I don&#8217;t know.</p>
<p>The idea of moving schools and kinda, like, starting over has (perhaps bizarrely) never appealed to me at all. It feels like the guy who hits .407 for a season, and decides to start over again the next year hitting from the opposite side of the plate. That&#8217;s a challenge, sure, but why would you seek out that kind of challenge? Plus, I&#8217;ve got this thing where if I&#8217;m not teaching the poorest, darkest, most under-taught kids whose first-language is something other than English, I feel guilty and weak. Like, I feel bad about teaching in east San Jose sometimes, because I could probably find spots in Oakland and L.A. where shit is worse. Let&#8217;s not even talk about this too much&#8230;</p>
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		<title>
		By: dan		</title>
		<link>/2008/how-do-you-solve-a-problem-like-tmao/#comment-110270</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 05:35:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=829#comment-110270</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@&lt;strong&gt;Joe&lt;/strong&gt;, I totally agree that we&#039;ll never reach 100% efficacy.  I disagree, though, that the jump from 50% efficacy to 75% efficacy is as meaningful as the next year&#039;s jump from 75% to 85% and so on.

For a particular group of educators – a group which I am &lt;em&gt;not&lt;/em&gt; deifying – the returns on the usual classroom grind diminish more quickly than for others.  I admit to some surprise that &lt;strong&gt;Tom&lt;/strong&gt; and &lt;strong&gt;Bill&lt;/strong&gt;, both refugees from the classroom, don&#039;t identify more with this group.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@<strong>Joe</strong>, I totally agree that we&#8217;ll never reach 100% efficacy.  I disagree, though, that the jump from 50% efficacy to 75% efficacy is as meaningful as the next year&#8217;s jump from 75% to 85% and so on.</p>
<p>For a particular group of educators – a group which I am <em>not</em> deifying – the returns on the usual classroom grind diminish more quickly than for others.  I admit to some surprise that <strong>Tom</strong> and <strong>Bill</strong>, both refugees from the classroom, don&#8217;t identify more with this group.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Joe		</title>
		<link>/2008/how-do-you-solve-a-problem-like-tmao/#comment-110238</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Joe]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 04:07:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=829#comment-110238</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I&#039;ve been lurking for a year... 

If you don&#039;t get up for the kids, then you should probably get out. If you want to help people become better teachers and develop ways for those teachers to get better, then you maybe should consider a doctorate in education and becoming a teacher of teachers? 

It sounds like TMAO is someone who looks at what his lesson is going to be, tries to improve it to reach more of the kids, then is pleased when he sees the improvement. I&#039;m not exactly sure what his problem is, because I&#039;m pretty sure there will always be room for improvement! I just finished my first year (yay!) and have about 20,000 things I like to try next year. I think if I get all 20,000 done, I&#039;ll have 15,000 more next year at this time. I mean, shouldn&#039;t that be what we&#039;re all doing? We&#039;re never going to get 100% effective 100% of the time.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve been lurking for a year&#8230; </p>
<p>If you don&#8217;t get up for the kids, then you should probably get out. If you want to help people become better teachers and develop ways for those teachers to get better, then you maybe should consider a doctorate in education and becoming a teacher of teachers? </p>
<p>It sounds like TMAO is someone who looks at what his lesson is going to be, tries to improve it to reach more of the kids, then is pleased when he sees the improvement. I&#8217;m not exactly sure what his problem is, because I&#8217;m pretty sure there will always be room for improvement! I just finished my first year (yay!) and have about 20,000 things I like to try next year. I think if I get all 20,000 done, I&#8217;ll have 15,000 more next year at this time. I mean, shouldn&#8217;t that be what we&#8217;re all doing? We&#8217;re never going to get 100% effective 100% of the time.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Clint H		</title>
		<link>/2008/how-do-you-solve-a-problem-like-tmao/#comment-110226</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Clint H]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 03:39:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=829#comment-110226</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@Dan I think this is a issue that is bigger than TMAO. He is (and I hope he&#039;s not offended by this idea) our case study and his situation will apply to many of us at some point in our careers, if it hasn&#039;t already. How do we, as teachers, keep our (personal) motivation to do what we do? If your motivation is intrinsic and never wavering, then Hallelujah and Congratulations: you&#039;ve reached the promised land.

I know I struggle with this on some level year after year. How do I constantly re-invent myself? How do I keep from growing stale or jaded? How do I reconcile spending more time with &lt;em&gt;other people&#039;s&lt;/em&gt; kids than my own?

For TMAO, I guess the question I want answered is: Do you want to leave education, or do you want to leave your school? There are options in either case...]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Dan I think this is a issue that is bigger than TMAO. He is (and I hope he&#8217;s not offended by this idea) our case study and his situation will apply to many of us at some point in our careers, if it hasn&#8217;t already. How do we, as teachers, keep our (personal) motivation to do what we do? If your motivation is intrinsic and never wavering, then Hallelujah and Congratulations: you&#8217;ve reached the promised land.</p>
<p>I know I struggle with this on some level year after year. How do I constantly re-invent myself? How do I keep from growing stale or jaded? How do I reconcile spending more time with <em>other people&#8217;s</em> kids than my own?</p>
<p>For TMAO, I guess the question I want answered is: Do you want to leave education, or do you want to leave your school? There are options in either case&#8230;</p>
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		By: dan		</title>
		<link>/2008/how-do-you-solve-a-problem-like-tmao/#comment-110209</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 02:16:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=829#comment-110209</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Too much interesting stuff to hit in a shot but I&#039;ve gotta note all the bloody fish guts &lt;strong&gt;Bill&lt;/strong&gt; threw into the water, bucket and all.

It&#039;s pretty easy to blame the NCLB boogeyman for anything and everything but it&#039;s worth noting in this case that it was &lt;em&gt;NCLB&#039;s accountability demands&lt;/em&gt; that offered TMAO the challenges which sustained him for these years.

Moreover, &quot;All challenges are worthwhile challenges&quot; disregards the not-inconsequential fact that different challenges satisfy differently.

eg. Any student who can&#039;t multiply numbers or who feels abandoned by math represents a worthy challenge but, each successive year, those extra ten hours per week I spend on differentiated assessment and engaging instruction feel decreasingly satisfying.

I need a place to generate ideas, ideas which live only a few degrees of separation from students but which don&#039;t require &lt;em&gt;my&lt;/em&gt; implementation year after year.

Is this just a consultant?  Some kind of journeyman teacher?

Just hijacked my own thread – my bad – this is and, uh, always has been, about TMAO.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Too much interesting stuff to hit in a shot but I&#8217;ve gotta note all the bloody fish guts <strong>Bill</strong> threw into the water, bucket and all.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s pretty easy to blame the NCLB boogeyman for anything and everything but it&#8217;s worth noting in this case that it was <em>NCLB&#8217;s accountability demands</em> that offered TMAO the challenges which sustained him for these years.</p>
<p>Moreover, &#8220;All challenges are worthwhile challenges&#8221; disregards the not-inconsequential fact that different challenges satisfy differently.</p>
<p>eg. Any student who can&#8217;t multiply numbers or who feels abandoned by math represents a worthy challenge but, each successive year, those extra ten hours per week I spend on differentiated assessment and engaging instruction feel decreasingly satisfying.</p>
<p>I need a place to generate ideas, ideas which live only a few degrees of separation from students but which don&#8217;t require <em>my</em> implementation year after year.</p>
<p>Is this just a consultant?  Some kind of journeyman teacher?</p>
<p>Just hijacked my own thread – my bad – this is and, uh, always has been, about TMAO.</p>
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