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	Comments on: Clever Hans	</title>
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	<link>/2009/clever-hans/</link>
	<description>less helpful</description>
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		<title>
		By: Learning On The Job &#187; The Dinks &#8211; Inspiration Remembered		</title>
		<link>/2009/clever-hans/#comment-252962</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Learning On The Job &#187; The Dinks &#8211; Inspiration Remembered]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Dec 2009 03:31:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=5135#comment-252962</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[...] about a month ago, Dan points us all to Ben Blum Smith&#8217;s post about Clever Hans, the counting horse. After reading [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] about a month ago, Dan points us all to Ben Blum Smith&#8217;s post about Clever Hans, the counting horse. After reading [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>
		By: Joanne		</title>
		<link>/2009/clever-hans/#comment-251957</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Joanne]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Nov 2009 05:38:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=5135#comment-251957</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Teaching students how to write &quot;leveled questions&quot; using Bloom/Marzano/Costas models provides challenges at all levels and usually results in better questions than those provided by publishers because the students find their own relevance. The best part is that the responsibility for demonstrating the process required to answer the question(s) and to explain their thinking lands squarely on the shoulders of the students and not the teacher. &quot;How do you know if this process is correct&quot; can be the teacher&#039;s question leading to proof.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Teaching students how to write &#8220;leveled questions&#8221; using Bloom/Marzano/Costas models provides challenges at all levels and usually results in better questions than those provided by publishers because the students find their own relevance. The best part is that the responsibility for demonstrating the process required to answer the question(s) and to explain their thinking lands squarely on the shoulders of the students and not the teacher. &#8220;How do you know if this process is correct&#8221; can be the teacher&#8217;s question leading to proof.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Jenny		</title>
		<link>/2009/clever-hans/#comment-251867</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jenny]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 02:00:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=5135#comment-251867</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[It would help a lot if we started this sort of thing at a much earlier age. I try to do this with my first graders and some of them respond similarly to your students. Others immediately explain their thinking. 

I have also noticed this with my daughter. We&#039;ve always asked her how she knows something or how she figured it out. Now she begins to explain how she did it without us asking. She seems to take pride in her explanation as much as in the correct answer. It does a mom proud.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It would help a lot if we started this sort of thing at a much earlier age. I try to do this with my first graders and some of them respond similarly to your students. Others immediately explain their thinking. </p>
<p>I have also noticed this with my daughter. We&#8217;ve always asked her how she knows something or how she figured it out. Now she begins to explain how she did it without us asking. She seems to take pride in her explanation as much as in the correct answer. It does a mom proud.</p>
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		<title>
		By: geek.teacher &#187; Blog Archive &#187; This week&#8217;s comments elsewhere (weekly)		</title>
		<link>/2009/clever-hans/#comment-251863</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[geek.teacher &#187; Blog Archive &#187; This week&#8217;s comments elsewhere (weekly)]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 23:30:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=5135#comment-251863</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[...] dy/dan Â» Blog Archive Â» Clever Hans [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] dy/dan Â» Blog Archive Â» Clever Hans [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>
		By: Dan Meyer		</title>
		<link>/2009/clever-hans/#comment-251862</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan Meyer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 23:12:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=5135#comment-251862</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Robert&lt;/strong&gt;: Do we need learners to need us as arbiters of correctness and truth?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Seems like they can get that anywhere, doesn&#039;t it.

I feel the most useful to my classes when I can ask a question, receive their explanation of an answer, ask another question to illustrate a soft spot in their argument, and then put them in a position to self-correct. Those moments aren&#039;t common for me.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p><strong>Robert</strong>: Do we need learners to need us as arbiters of correctness and truth?</p></blockquote>
<p>Seems like they can get that anywhere, doesn&#8217;t it.</p>
<p>I feel the most useful to my classes when I can ask a question, receive their explanation of an answer, ask another question to illustrate a soft spot in their argument, and then put them in a position to self-correct. Those moments aren&#8217;t common for me.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Fran		</title>
		<link>/2009/clever-hans/#comment-251856</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Fran]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 20:40:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=5135#comment-251856</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Another good question we use in physics is &quot;how do you know?&quot;  It does not imply an answer is incorrect, and requires an explanation from the student.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another good question we use in physics is &#8220;how do you know?&#8221;  It does not imply an answer is incorrect, and requires an explanation from the student.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Robert Jones		</title>
		<link>/2009/clever-hans/#comment-251844</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Robert Jones]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 09:29:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=5135#comment-251844</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Great post. Three thoughts:
 
The &#039;think-pair-share&#039; strategy helps here - youngsters discuss their ideas with a partner first, before sharing with class.  No teacher involvement until they have already vocalised their thinking.

It is much harder to get a &#039;tell&#039; when you are communicating online.  Maybe online learning has an edge here.

This whole issue is a symptom of &quot;teacher as priest&quot;.  Do we need learners to need us as arbiters of correctness and truth?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post. Three thoughts:</p>
<p>The &#8216;think-pair-share&#8217; strategy helps here &#8211; youngsters discuss their ideas with a partner first, before sharing with class.  No teacher involvement until they have already vocalised their thinking.</p>
<p>It is much harder to get a &#8216;tell&#8217; when you are communicating online.  Maybe online learning has an edge here.</p>
<p>This whole issue is a symptom of &#8220;teacher as priest&#8221;.  Do we need learners to need us as arbiters of correctness and truth?</p>
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		<title>
		By: Jason Dyer		</title>
		<link>/2009/clever-hans/#comment-251838</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jason Dyer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 05:06:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=5135#comment-251838</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Related, if you haven&#039;t seen this one...

http://numberwarrior.wordpress.com/2009/05/12/my-favorite-educational-psychology-experiment/]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Related, if you haven&#8217;t seen this one&#8230;</p>
<p><a href="http://numberwarrior.wordpress.com/2009/05/12/my-favorite-educational-psychology-experiment/" rel="nofollow ugc">http://numberwarrior.wordpress.com/2009/05/12/my-favorite-educational-psychology-experiment/</a></p>
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		<title>
		By: Dan Meyer		</title>
		<link>/2009/clever-hans/#comment-251837</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan Meyer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 04:43:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=5135#comment-251837</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Right on both. It is kind of staggering to me that in the midst of an otherwise solid ed program, this sort of teacher response system was never discussed.

We got into wait time. Like, &quot;don&#039;t just answer your own question when there&#039;s silence,&quot; but nothing like this kind of utterly essential Jedi mind trick.

I&#039;d like to trade notes on one point with both of you: it takes me a matter of months to rid most students of their dependence on my reaction for their response. Months. The process is much quicker than I&#039;d imagine.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Right on both. It is kind of staggering to me that in the midst of an otherwise solid ed program, this sort of teacher response system was never discussed.</p>
<p>We got into wait time. Like, &#8220;don&#8217;t just answer your own question when there&#8217;s silence,&#8221; but nothing like this kind of utterly essential Jedi mind trick.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d like to trade notes on one point with both of you: it takes me a matter of months to rid most students of their dependence on my reaction for their response. Months. The process is much quicker than I&#8217;d imagine.</p>
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		<title>
		By: josh g.		</title>
		<link>/2009/clever-hans/#comment-251836</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[josh g.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 03:54:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=5135#comment-251836</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I&#039;ve been trying something similar during my student teaching, except usually I ask something like, &quot;Why is that true?&quot; or &quot;Where did you get that answer from?&quot;  And yeah, almost every time I&#039;ve said that students started second-guessing and thinking they got the wrong answer.  

If they get too deer-in-the-headlights then sometimes I let them know that they have the right answer, I just want them to explain how they got there.  But that&#039;s a short-term fix for poor self-efficacy and risks turning into a new cue.  (Revised student algorithm: answer, look scared when asked to explain, wait to see if you are told you&#039;re correct.)]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve been trying something similar during my student teaching, except usually I ask something like, &#8220;Why is that true?&#8221; or &#8220;Where did you get that answer from?&#8221;  And yeah, almost every time I&#8217;ve said that students started second-guessing and thinking they got the wrong answer.  </p>
<p>If they get too deer-in-the-headlights then sometimes I let them know that they have the right answer, I just want them to explain how they got there.  But that&#8217;s a short-term fix for poor self-efficacy and risks turning into a new cue.  (Revised student algorithm: answer, look scared when asked to explain, wait to see if you are told you&#8217;re correct.)</p>
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