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	Comments on: Pseudoteaching: What Was Complex Becomes Routine	</title>
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		<title>
		By: Sue VanHattum		</title>
		<link>/2011/pseudoteaching-what-was-complex-becomes-routine/#comment-408111</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sue VanHattum]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Mar 2012 15:22:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=9413#comment-408111</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&#062;Could you tell me why the tip of the first sine petal is always on the polar axis?

First cosine petal, right?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;Could you tell me why the tip of the first sine petal is always on the polar axis?</p>
<p>First cosine petal, right?</p>
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		<title>
		By: Launa		</title>
		<link>/2011/pseudoteaching-what-was-complex-becomes-routine/#comment-339183</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Launa]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Oct 2011 10:29:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=9413#comment-339183</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I love that you hold yourself to this amazing high standard:  that every kid learns at a high level, every class. 

I&#039;m an old (humanities) teacher working with a new age group at a new school, and realize just how rarely I am able to get up to that level in my new setting.  Whereas before I could convince myself that I was there a lot -- now, hardly at all. 

I&#039;m looking, instead, at progress-over-time, when I feel like a failure.  Here at six weeks into the semester they have certainly learned, even though I could hardly see it unfolding on a daily basis, and had so many pseudoteaching fails along the way.  

Thanks for the reminder of exactly what I am striving for.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love that you hold yourself to this amazing high standard:  that every kid learns at a high level, every class. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m an old (humanities) teacher working with a new age group at a new school, and realize just how rarely I am able to get up to that level in my new setting.  Whereas before I could convince myself that I was there a lot &#8212; now, hardly at all. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m looking, instead, at progress-over-time, when I feel like a failure.  Here at six weeks into the semester they have certainly learned, even though I could hardly see it unfolding on a daily basis, and had so many pseudoteaching fails along the way.  </p>
<p>Thanks for the reminder of exactly what I am striving for.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Jovan Miles		</title>
		<link>/2011/pseudoteaching-what-was-complex-becomes-routine/#comment-278583</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jovan Miles]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Feb 2011 14:41:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=9413#comment-278583</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Hey Dan, I always read but rarely comment!

Your point about algorithms not making sense to people unless they know what the algorithm is going to do just hit home with me.

I&#039;m currently working as an instructional math coach with 2 alternative schools that serve special education students.

I&#039;m looking over diagnostic tests and noticing a pattern of students simply not knowing what the algorithm is supposed to do...

I&#039;m going to share this post with my teachers and hopefully they&#039;ll get something out of it.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Dan, I always read but rarely comment!</p>
<p>Your point about algorithms not making sense to people unless they know what the algorithm is going to do just hit home with me.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m currently working as an instructional math coach with 2 alternative schools that serve special education students.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m looking over diagnostic tests and noticing a pattern of students simply not knowing what the algorithm is supposed to do&#8230;</p>
<p>I&#8217;m going to share this post with my teachers and hopefully they&#8217;ll get something out of it.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Dave Smith		</title>
		<link>/2011/pseudoteaching-what-was-complex-becomes-routine/#comment-278461</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dave Smith]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Feb 2011 03:24:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=9413#comment-278461</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Just a quick note on graphing by hand.  Ever since I took a short course from Win Means at SUNY Albany on Mohr&#039;s Circle (a graphical method for working with tensors), I have been much more likely to use sketch graphing and have a much greater appreciation for the potential of a simple sketch to convey useful and even reasonably precise quantitative information.  When I realized I did not understand the functions above, I started in with SpaceTime on my iPad, but the finished graph lacked the information to show me how the petals connected to the trig function, especially since it converted all the coordinates to x, y pairs.  I grabbed a handy envelope and went to work on a sketched polar plot, going from cos(theta) to cos (2theta) and within 5 or 10 minutes I had the basics figured out.  

Dave]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just a quick note on graphing by hand.  Ever since I took a short course from Win Means at SUNY Albany on Mohr&#8217;s Circle (a graphical method for working with tensors), I have been much more likely to use sketch graphing and have a much greater appreciation for the potential of a simple sketch to convey useful and even reasonably precise quantitative information.  When I realized I did not understand the functions above, I started in with SpaceTime on my iPad, but the finished graph lacked the information to show me how the petals connected to the trig function, especially since it converted all the coordinates to x, y pairs.  I grabbed a handy envelope and went to work on a sketched polar plot, going from cos(theta) to cos (2theta) and within 5 or 10 minutes I had the basics figured out.  </p>
<p>Dave</p>
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		<title>
		By: Dave Smith		</title>
		<link>/2011/pseudoteaching-what-was-complex-becomes-routine/#comment-278460</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dave Smith]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Feb 2011 03:13:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=9413#comment-278460</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Thanks all, for a very thought provoking discussion.  

I discovered my own psuedoteaching on a big scale one semester when I read the NSTA&#039;s wonderful little pamphlet &quot;Ask the Right Questions.&quot; In it they suggested using additional wait time after answers, not just after questions, and perhaps even adding in a little gesture to ask for more.  I went in full of confidence to the next day&#039;s class (upper level college geology class that I was very pleased with - lots of engagement, lots of good answers to my questions, etc).  Well, first there was the panic stricken look in the eyes of my students.  More?!  What do you mean more?!  Then there was the uncomfortable pause.  Then there was the complete nonsense that came out of their mouths.  Then it was my turn to panic (Oh no! They haven&#039;t actually learned anything!  Now what?!).  It really was remarkable - The first couple of words in response to each of my questions were generally a correct short answer, and the next ten or twenty or more words were confused, rambling, or just plain wrong.  

What I eventually learned from that experience was that I had to let/make the students do a LOT more talking.  Only once students were talking did I have any way to know whether they had any idea what was going on.  I began to focus my teaching on data sets.  &quot;Here are first person accounts of different kinds of volcanoes, what patterns do you notice?&quot;  Yes it took time and so I cut down my curriculum to 6 big ideas in a semester (15 class/lab hours per idea). I did much less preparation for specific class activities and much more lying awake at night thinking &quot;Is this really the most important idea for this unit, or can I get away with leaving them confused for now?&quot; 

@Frank Noschese this is why I have been a huge fan of Modeling Instruction (modeling.asu.edu) ever since I first read about it.

Thanks for the journey back into polar coordinates, too.  I had to use Excel to generate a table and scratch out a sketch graph before I began to understand what was going on, even though I clearly recall learning how to predict the number of petals once upon a time.  

Dave]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks all, for a very thought provoking discussion.  </p>
<p>I discovered my own psuedoteaching on a big scale one semester when I read the NSTA&#8217;s wonderful little pamphlet &#8220;Ask the Right Questions.&#8221; In it they suggested using additional wait time after answers, not just after questions, and perhaps even adding in a little gesture to ask for more.  I went in full of confidence to the next day&#8217;s class (upper level college geology class that I was very pleased with &#8211; lots of engagement, lots of good answers to my questions, etc).  Well, first there was the panic stricken look in the eyes of my students.  More?!  What do you mean more?!  Then there was the uncomfortable pause.  Then there was the complete nonsense that came out of their mouths.  Then it was my turn to panic (Oh no! They haven&#8217;t actually learned anything!  Now what?!).  It really was remarkable &#8211; The first couple of words in response to each of my questions were generally a correct short answer, and the next ten or twenty or more words were confused, rambling, or just plain wrong.  </p>
<p>What I eventually learned from that experience was that I had to let/make the students do a LOT more talking.  Only once students were talking did I have any way to know whether they had any idea what was going on.  I began to focus my teaching on data sets.  &#8220;Here are first person accounts of different kinds of volcanoes, what patterns do you notice?&#8221;  Yes it took time and so I cut down my curriculum to 6 big ideas in a semester (15 class/lab hours per idea). I did much less preparation for specific class activities and much more lying awake at night thinking &#8220;Is this really the most important idea for this unit, or can I get away with leaving them confused for now?&#8221; </p>
<p>@Frank Noschese this is why I have been a huge fan of Modeling Instruction (modeling.asu.edu) ever since I first read about it.</p>
<p>Thanks for the journey back into polar coordinates, too.  I had to use Excel to generate a table and scratch out a sketch graph before I began to understand what was going on, even though I clearly recall learning how to predict the number of petals once upon a time.  </p>
<p>Dave</p>
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		<title>
		By: Fachler		</title>
		<link>/2011/pseudoteaching-what-was-complex-becomes-routine/#comment-277999</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Fachler]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Feb 2011 22:26:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=9413#comment-277999</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I think they key here was the end realization: by facilitating performances during which students created (and then probably evaluated), a teacher would be able to accurately gauge understanding, which is the goal--not just performance or knowledge.  I think this is where the task analysis folks miss the boat.

I believe students should be in a constant state of production.  As one of the &quot;straggling humanities teachers&quot; still following along in the discussion, it&#039;s easy for me: students are always writing, revising, conferring, and creating class-wide and personal language arts-based projects.  For the example above, I might ask, &quot;What were the students creating with these rose petal formation graphs?&quot;  

It&#039;s tough to get kids to understand something if the final output is just graphs.  Graphs for what purpose?  The Teaching for Understanding (TfU) framework calls the steps along the way &quot;understanding performances&quot; because the students understands more deeply with each scaffolded output (from initial inquiry, to guided, to independent).  

As you have already pointed out the aesthetic qualities of those rose petals, perhaps an art-based summative output wherein students had to manipulate the equations for intended results (i.e. students sketch first, plan out the art, then have to troubleshoot the math to make it work) might have engendered transfer.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think they key here was the end realization: by facilitating performances during which students created (and then probably evaluated), a teacher would be able to accurately gauge understanding, which is the goal&#8211;not just performance or knowledge.  I think this is where the task analysis folks miss the boat.</p>
<p>I believe students should be in a constant state of production.  As one of the &#8220;straggling humanities teachers&#8221; still following along in the discussion, it&#8217;s easy for me: students are always writing, revising, conferring, and creating class-wide and personal language arts-based projects.  For the example above, I might ask, &#8220;What were the students creating with these rose petal formation graphs?&#8221;  </p>
<p>It&#8217;s tough to get kids to understand something if the final output is just graphs.  Graphs for what purpose?  The Teaching for Understanding (TfU) framework calls the steps along the way &#8220;understanding performances&#8221; because the students understands more deeply with each scaffolded output (from initial inquiry, to guided, to independent).  </p>
<p>As you have already pointed out the aesthetic qualities of those rose petals, perhaps an art-based summative output wherein students had to manipulate the equations for intended results (i.e. students sketch first, plan out the art, then have to troubleshoot the math to make it work) might have engendered transfer.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Luke Hodge		</title>
		<link>/2011/pseudoteaching-what-was-complex-becomes-routine/#comment-277998</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Luke Hodge]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Feb 2011 22:20:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=9413#comment-277998</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[It seems to me that asking what the parameters a &#038; b do for the functions r=asin(bt) provides a nice visual surprise, still has a little bit of meat to it, and avoids the tedium of graphing by hand.  

Plotting points in hopes of a graph taking some sort of form is not an approach (at least not a first approach) that I would want to encourage.  I would much rather see if I can figure anything out by looking at the equation first - then pick some nice points to plot.

I think the &quot;why&quot; part of this is accessible if you focus on values of t that minimize/maximize r - which is also a relatively appetizing question.  Finding values of t, by hand, which minimize/maximize r is not tedious &#038; very clearly shows why you get the number of loops that you do - it is all about the period &#038; whether some loops will overlap previous loops.  I think most people would likely need a hint or instructions to focus on max/mins for r, though.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It seems to me that asking what the parameters a &amp; b do for the functions r=asin(bt) provides a nice visual surprise, still has a little bit of meat to it, and avoids the tedium of graphing by hand.  </p>
<p>Plotting points in hopes of a graph taking some sort of form is not an approach (at least not a first approach) that I would want to encourage.  I would much rather see if I can figure anything out by looking at the equation first &#8211; then pick some nice points to plot.</p>
<p>I think the &#8220;why&#8221; part of this is accessible if you focus on values of t that minimize/maximize r &#8211; which is also a relatively appetizing question.  Finding values of t, by hand, which minimize/maximize r is not tedious &amp; very clearly shows why you get the number of loops that you do &#8211; it is all about the period &amp; whether some loops will overlap previous loops.  I think most people would likely need a hint or instructions to focus on max/mins for r, though.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Jason Dyer		</title>
		<link>/2011/pseudoteaching-what-was-complex-becomes-routine/#comment-277984</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jason Dyer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Feb 2011 20:45:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=9413#comment-277984</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@Dan: Not disagreeing -- I&#039;ve run polar coordination exploration in class before -- just being cautious. It didn&#039;t read like a complete lesson to me yet.

&lt;em&gt;So…students will be able to understand “why” before they’re able to clearly explain the “why.”&lt;/em&gt;

@Laura: This is the knotty bit I&#039;d love to unravel: how do you tell when this happens? I&#039;ve certainly done explorations where students had the patterns down as brainlessly as if I&#039;d just told them a recipe. I&#039;d love to avoid that, but sometimes it&#039;s a hard thing to check. The standard approach is to add a wrinkle and recheck for understanding (like mentioned in the example, adding a negative) but that&#039;s not foolproof.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Dan: Not disagreeing &#8212; I&#8217;ve run polar coordination exploration in class before &#8212; just being cautious. It didn&#8217;t read like a complete lesson to me yet.</p>
<p><em>So…students will be able to understand “why” before they’re able to clearly explain the “why.”</em></p>
<p>@Laura: This is the knotty bit I&#8217;d love to unravel: how do you tell when this happens? I&#8217;ve certainly done explorations where students had the patterns down as brainlessly as if I&#8217;d just told them a recipe. I&#8217;d love to avoid that, but sometimes it&#8217;s a hard thing to check. The standard approach is to add a wrinkle and recheck for understanding (like mentioned in the example, adding a negative) but that&#8217;s not foolproof.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Amy		</title>
		<link>/2011/pseudoteaching-what-was-complex-becomes-routine/#comment-277980</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Amy]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Feb 2011 19:12:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=9413#comment-277980</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I explored this on my own as a high school student.  As soon as I started drawing out the waves, I noticed that whether or not the wave had point symmetry affected the number of petals, and it was easy to see and explain how the &quot;b&quot; could manipulate that point symmetry.

.... at least that&#039;s what I remember, it&#039;s been YEARS since I&#039;ve explored polar coordinates!

Signed,
Humanities-Type]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I explored this on my own as a high school student.  As soon as I started drawing out the waves, I noticed that whether or not the wave had point symmetry affected the number of petals, and it was easy to see and explain how the &#8220;b&#8221; could manipulate that point symmetry.</p>
<p>&#8230;. at least that&#8217;s what I remember, it&#8217;s been YEARS since I&#8217;ve explored polar coordinates!</p>
<p>Signed,<br />
Humanities-Type</p>
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		<title>
		By: Brian Wyzlic		</title>
		<link>/2011/pseudoteaching-what-was-complex-becomes-routine/#comment-277973</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Brian Wyzlic]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Feb 2011 18:36:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=9413#comment-277973</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[One thing that was repeated a lot during my undergrad courses was &quot;play with it.&quot; While this is not something I could say without context to a group that includes high school males, that is what I asked my pre-calc students to do. All my students either had a graphing calculator or could borrow one overnight. Towards the end of class, we went over how to put the calculator in polar form (they already know what polar graphing is, we just hadn&#039;t done much with it yet), and we look at a few graphs involving sin and cos. Then they take some time in class to play with it, and their assignment for the night is to play around with polar graphing and find some patterns.

The next day, we have a whole mess of patterns that have been found, and as a class, we can explore why those patterns exist. It works pretty well, though it does not rule out pseudoteaching without the next day exploration.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One thing that was repeated a lot during my undergrad courses was &#8220;play with it.&#8221; While this is not something I could say without context to a group that includes high school males, that is what I asked my pre-calc students to do. All my students either had a graphing calculator or could borrow one overnight. Towards the end of class, we went over how to put the calculator in polar form (they already know what polar graphing is, we just hadn&#8217;t done much with it yet), and we look at a few graphs involving sin and cos. Then they take some time in class to play with it, and their assignment for the night is to play around with polar graphing and find some patterns.</p>
<p>The next day, we have a whole mess of patterns that have been found, and as a class, we can explore why those patterns exist. It works pretty well, though it does not rule out pseudoteaching without the next day exploration.</p>
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