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	Comments on: [Makeover] Painted Cubes Preview	</title>
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	<description>less helpful</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2014 19:41:30 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: Marcia Weinhold		</title>
		<link>/2014/makeover-painted-cubes-preview/#comment-1916602</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Marcia Weinhold]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2014 19:41:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=19893#comment-1916602</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I served for awhile as &quot;outreach coordinator&quot; for teachers beginning to implement the Core Plus high school curriculum, and one of the things we noted was that teachers really felt the need to organize things for their students.  The larger the class size, the greater the need to do this, so that you can be sure everyone is &quot;making progress&quot; on the problem. If every student or group is writing their own organization, the teacher has to stay at each group longer to figure out what is going on, and to catch the mathematical moments. When classroom management is an issue (let&#039;s face it), teachers will organize the math in order to facilitate the management. What sometimes happens, however, is that the students have a somewhat false sense of &quot;understanding&quot; the math, when what they have actually done is filled in someone else&#039;s tables. So the preparation they have for the future is to follow specific directions, not to formulate and solve problems.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I served for awhile as &#8220;outreach coordinator&#8221; for teachers beginning to implement the Core Plus high school curriculum, and one of the things we noted was that teachers really felt the need to organize things for their students.  The larger the class size, the greater the need to do this, so that you can be sure everyone is &#8220;making progress&#8221; on the problem. If every student or group is writing their own organization, the teacher has to stay at each group longer to figure out what is going on, and to catch the mathematical moments. When classroom management is an issue (let&#8217;s face it), teachers will organize the math in order to facilitate the management. What sometimes happens, however, is that the students have a somewhat false sense of &#8220;understanding&#8221; the math, when what they have actually done is filled in someone else&#8217;s tables. So the preparation they have for the future is to follow specific directions, not to formulate and solve problems.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Dan Meyer		</title>
		<link>/2014/makeover-painted-cubes-preview/#comment-1914985</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan Meyer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2014 13:37:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=19893#comment-1914985</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Thanks for the comments, Clara and Chris.

Clara:

&lt;blockquote&gt;Dan- could you make more videos like the one with the penny pyramid? &lt;/blockquote&gt;

Noted!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the comments, Clara and Chris.</p>
<p>Clara:</p>
<blockquote><p>Dan- could you make more videos like the one with the penny pyramid? </p></blockquote>
<p>Noted!</p>
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		<title>
		By: Clara Maxcy		</title>
		<link>/2014/makeover-painted-cubes-preview/#comment-1914745</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Clara Maxcy]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2014 12:34:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=19893#comment-1914745</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Chris Shore makes a valid point about teachers that can &quot;take [the] image and run with it&quot; and the teachers who need a lesson on the lesson. I am in a co-taught setting and have found that when I use a rich task, I have to walk the other teacher through the task, the things to say (facilitation) and the things not to say (there is a tendency for many teachers to prompt or give answers). As I learn more and more about teaching with these tasks, there is more structure than first appears, to ensure that learning and not parroting is taking place. Each class is different, but the &quot;oh, I get it now!&quot; is so worth the process. 
I would like to see more training for teachers in basic facilitation of these tasks. 
Dan- could you make more videos like the one with the penny pyramid? That showed so clearly HOW to present the task and facilitate it. I&#039;ve shown and shared that when I need to communicate the process of tasks.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris Shore makes a valid point about teachers that can &#8220;take [the] image and run with it&#8221; and the teachers who need a lesson on the lesson. I am in a co-taught setting and have found that when I use a rich task, I have to walk the other teacher through the task, the things to say (facilitation) and the things not to say (there is a tendency for many teachers to prompt or give answers). As I learn more and more about teaching with these tasks, there is more structure than first appears, to ensure that learning and not parroting is taking place. Each class is different, but the &#8220;oh, I get it now!&#8221; is so worth the process.<br />
I would like to see more training for teachers in basic facilitation of these tasks.<br />
Dan- could you make more videos like the one with the penny pyramid? That showed so clearly HOW to present the task and facilitate it. I&#8217;ve shown and shared that when I need to communicate the process of tasks.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Chris Shore		</title>
		<link>/2014/makeover-painted-cubes-preview/#comment-1911746</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chris Shore]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Jun 2014 01:14:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=19893#comment-1911746</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In response to Bryan Meyer&#039;s comment on offering &quot;less scaffolding&quot; for students: I fully agree, but I think the problem needs to offer scaffolding for teachers. Unfortunately, there is not a lesson plan supplied to the teacher on taking this one question which was originally intended as a passing question within a set of &quot;homework exercises&quot; and developing it into a rich and robust task. 

As a math coach, I frequently field candid requests for training on the things that you and I take for granted in this activity (class discussion, group work, student conjecture, manipulatives, varying responses, improvisation, etc). Most of us reading this post would take Nicole Paris&#039; photo and run with it. The vast majority of teachers cannot.

With that said, this post and Bryan&#039;s comment have me thinking how to offer what is best for both students and teachers.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In response to Bryan Meyer&#8217;s comment on offering &#8220;less scaffolding&#8221; for students: I fully agree, but I think the problem needs to offer scaffolding for teachers. Unfortunately, there is not a lesson plan supplied to the teacher on taking this one question which was originally intended as a passing question within a set of &#8220;homework exercises&#8221; and developing it into a rich and robust task. </p>
<p>As a math coach, I frequently field candid requests for training on the things that you and I take for granted in this activity (class discussion, group work, student conjecture, manipulatives, varying responses, improvisation, etc). Most of us reading this post would take Nicole Paris&#8217; photo and run with it. The vast majority of teachers cannot.</p>
<p>With that said, this post and Bryan&#8217;s comment have me thinking how to offer what is best for both students and teachers.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Bryan Anderson		</title>
		<link>/2014/makeover-painted-cubes-preview/#comment-1867611</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Bryan Anderson]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jun 2014 21:11:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=19893#comment-1867611</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@Dan&#038;Chris: One thing to consider as well with the topic of teacher cues would be training in the curriculum.  Even though we purchased CMP and paid for &quot;training&quot;, it was training of &quot;hey, here are the cool features of CMP&quot;, mostly digital resources.  There was no instructional planning.  This is the downfall for many curriculums I have dealt with.  They need training on lesson design, instructional specific support (not just digital bells and whistles) and an actual lesson observation.  If you don&#039;t supply this, it doesn&#039;t matter how good of a curriculum you produce- implementation will be inconsistent to the point you can&#039;t even be sure it&#039;s presented to students as intended.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Dan&amp;Chris: One thing to consider as well with the topic of teacher cues would be training in the curriculum.  Even though we purchased CMP and paid for &#8220;training&#8221;, it was training of &#8220;hey, here are the cool features of CMP&#8221;, mostly digital resources.  There was no instructional planning.  This is the downfall for many curriculums I have dealt with.  They need training on lesson design, instructional specific support (not just digital bells and whistles) and an actual lesson observation.  If you don&#8217;t supply this, it doesn&#8217;t matter how good of a curriculum you produce- implementation will be inconsistent to the point you can&#8217;t even be sure it&#8217;s presented to students as intended.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Christopher Danielson		</title>
		<link>/2014/makeover-painted-cubes-preview/#comment-1865486</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Christopher Danielson]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jun 2014 14:05:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=19893#comment-1865486</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[The answer to your question varies widely, &lt;strong&gt;Dan&lt;/strong&gt;. Widely.

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.warner.rochester.edu/facultystaff/choppin/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Jeffrey Choppin at University of Rochester&lt;/a&gt; has looked into &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.academia.edu/443970/Learned_adaptations_Teachers_understanding_and_use_of_curriculum_resources&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;how teachers use the CMP teachers&#039; editions&lt;/a&gt;. It is case study work, though, so it does not pretend to inform us on how widespread the usage he finds is.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The answer to your question varies widely, <strong>Dan</strong>. Widely.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.warner.rochester.edu/facultystaff/choppin/" rel="nofollow">Jeffrey Choppin at University of Rochester</a> has looked into <a href="http://www.academia.edu/443970/Learned_adaptations_Teachers_understanding_and_use_of_curriculum_resources" rel="nofollow">how teachers use the CMP teachers&#8217; editions</a>. It is case study work, though, so it does not pretend to inform us on how widespread the usage he finds is.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Dan Meyer		</title>
		<link>/2014/makeover-painted-cubes-preview/#comment-1862784</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan Meyer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jun 2014 04:41:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=19893#comment-1862784</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Thanks for the behind-the-scenes perspective, &lt;strong&gt;Christopher&lt;/strong&gt;.

&lt;blockquote&gt;One of the important contributions that CMP has made in US math curriculum is a set of teacher materials that go beyond answer keys and teaching tips. It is a curriculum in which the student edition really isn&#039;t enough to get the whole picture.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Do you have a sense of how much teachers took their cues from the student edition vs. the teacher edition?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the behind-the-scenes perspective, <strong>Christopher</strong>.</p>
<blockquote><p>One of the important contributions that CMP has made in US math curriculum is a set of teacher materials that go beyond answer keys and teaching tips. It is a curriculum in which the student edition really isn&#8217;t enough to get the whole picture.</p></blockquote>
<p>Do you have a sense of how much teachers took their cues from the student edition vs. the teacher edition?</p>
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		<title>
		By: Taxi-Cab Geometry to describe Slope &#124; MathLab		</title>
		<link>/2014/makeover-painted-cubes-preview/#comment-1859387</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Taxi-Cab Geometry to describe Slope &#124; MathLab]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2014 16:53:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=19893#comment-1859387</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[&#8230;] Dan posted his Painted Cubes Makeover, it reminded me of another activity that was presented for Pythagorean Theorem work, but Students [&#8230;]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] Dan posted his Painted Cubes Makeover, it reminded me of another activity that was presented for Pythagorean Theorem work, but Students [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>
		By: Christopher		</title>
		<link>/2014/makeover-painted-cubes-preview/#comment-1858900</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Christopher]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2014 15:05:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=19893#comment-1858900</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[As someone with intimate knowledge of CMP, I want to add something to the conversation here.

&lt;strong&gt;Dan&lt;/strong&gt; writes:

&lt;blockquote&gt;My primary question about the CMP version is “how much help should we offer and when?” CMP has answered that question with “lots and right away!”&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Yes and no. 

It is absolutely the case that the student pages we see here answer that question in that way. Dan is not wrong at all here.

The teacher&#039;s edition talks about this problem in a somewhat different way, though. 

&lt;blockquote&gt;You can use a Rubik&#039;s Cube to launch the problem...Also having small unit cubes or sugar cubes around so students can build some of the smaller cubes of length 2, 3, or 4 will be very helpful...

[Ask students] Suppose we paint a cube with edge length of 10 cm and then separate it into 1,000 small centimeter cubes. How many of the small cubes will have paint on three faces [etc.]? (Let students make some conjectures. Some might notice that the cube on a corner will have three faces painted.) &lt;/blockquote&gt;

If I were given a stab at writing that TE text today, I would definitely include some language that explicitly asks teachers &lt;em&gt;not&lt;/em&gt; to over-organize things for kids, that explicitly encourages teachers to launch the problem without the student edition in front of them.

One of the important contributions that CMP has made in US math curriculum is a set of teacher materials that go beyond answer keys and teaching tips. It is a curriculum in which the student edition really isn&#039;t enough to get the whole picture.

The ongoing tension in every bit of CMP work I have been involved in has been between &lt;em&gt;open&lt;/em&gt; and &lt;em&gt;structured&lt;/em&gt;. How much structure do teachers need in order to get kids into a place where they notice and work on the important mathematics? Too little structure creates a problem (viz. the basketball game breaking out on the checkerboard in the present discussion). Too much structure creates a problem (this is the premise of the critique here).

I think two questions are in play here:

(1) How much structure/direction do we want the lesson to have in an ideal implementation?

and 

(2) How much structure/direction do student materials need to have in order to get as many classrooms as possible as close as possible to this ideal?

These are really difficult questions. They are asked regularly among CMP authors, writers, teachers and professional development folks. I am glad that you are asking them, too, Dan. 

That student page deserves the critique you give it. And yet the curriculum&#039;s goals are more nuanced than the student page suggests.

I am sad to report that I am 40 minutes away from my office where my CMP1 books are housed (the image here is from CMP2). Thus I cannot produce for you an image of the CMP1 version of this problem, and I cannot recall whether it had the same structure. It is absolutely the case that publisher and classroom feedback pushed the writing team to make many problems &lt;em&gt;more&lt;/em&gt; structured in CMP2 than they had been in CMP1.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As someone with intimate knowledge of CMP, I want to add something to the conversation here.</p>
<p><strong>Dan</strong> writes:</p>
<blockquote><p>My primary question about the CMP version is “how much help should we offer and when?” CMP has answered that question with “lots and right away!”</p></blockquote>
<p>Yes and no. </p>
<p>It is absolutely the case that the student pages we see here answer that question in that way. Dan is not wrong at all here.</p>
<p>The teacher&#8217;s edition talks about this problem in a somewhat different way, though. </p>
<blockquote><p>You can use a Rubik&#8217;s Cube to launch the problem&#8230;Also having small unit cubes or sugar cubes around so students can build some of the smaller cubes of length 2, 3, or 4 will be very helpful&#8230;</p>
<p>[Ask students] Suppose we paint a cube with edge length of 10 cm and then separate it into 1,000 small centimeter cubes. How many of the small cubes will have paint on three faces [etc.]? (Let students make some conjectures. Some might notice that the cube on a corner will have three faces painted.) </p></blockquote>
<p>If I were given a stab at writing that TE text today, I would definitely include some language that explicitly asks teachers <em>not</em> to over-organize things for kids, that explicitly encourages teachers to launch the problem without the student edition in front of them.</p>
<p>One of the important contributions that CMP has made in US math curriculum is a set of teacher materials that go beyond answer keys and teaching tips. It is a curriculum in which the student edition really isn&#8217;t enough to get the whole picture.</p>
<p>The ongoing tension in every bit of CMP work I have been involved in has been between <em>open</em> and <em>structured</em>. How much structure do teachers need in order to get kids into a place where they notice and work on the important mathematics? Too little structure creates a problem (viz. the basketball game breaking out on the checkerboard in the present discussion). Too much structure creates a problem (this is the premise of the critique here).</p>
<p>I think two questions are in play here:</p>
<p>(1) How much structure/direction do we want the lesson to have in an ideal implementation?</p>
<p>and </p>
<p>(2) How much structure/direction do student materials need to have in order to get as many classrooms as possible as close as possible to this ideal?</p>
<p>These are really difficult questions. They are asked regularly among CMP authors, writers, teachers and professional development folks. I am glad that you are asking them, too, Dan. </p>
<p>That student page deserves the critique you give it. And yet the curriculum&#8217;s goals are more nuanced than the student page suggests.</p>
<p>I am sad to report that I am 40 minutes away from my office where my CMP1 books are housed (the image here is from CMP2). Thus I cannot produce for you an image of the CMP1 version of this problem, and I cannot recall whether it had the same structure. It is absolutely the case that publisher and classroom feedback pushed the writing team to make many problems <em>more</em> structured in CMP2 than they had been in CMP1.</p>
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		<title>
		By: dy/dan &#187; Blog Archive &#187; &#8220;You Can Always Add. You Can&#8217;t Subtract.&#8221;		</title>
		<link>/2014/makeover-painted-cubes-preview/#comment-1858738</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dy/dan &#187; Blog Archive &#187; &#8220;You Can Always Add. You Can&#8217;t Subtract.&#8221;]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2014 14:24:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=19893#comment-1858738</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[&#8230;] a/k/a [Makeover] Painted Cubes (See preview.) [&#8230;]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] a/k/a [Makeover] Painted Cubes (See preview.) [&#8230;]</p>
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