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	<title>
	Comments on: Teach Students Correct But Useless Steps	</title>
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	<link>/2014/teach-students-correct-but-useless-steps/</link>
	<description>less helpful</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 22 Oct 2014 03:45:38 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: Shelley		</title>
		<link>/2014/teach-students-correct-but-useless-steps/#comment-2261805</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Shelley]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Oct 2014 03:45:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21688#comment-2261805</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Just noticed a link to CMC14 in &quot;Recent Comments&quot;.  Glad to see &quot;My Favorite No&quot; from the Teaching Channel in there.  That is one of my favorites for building a culture where incorrect steps can be useful.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just noticed a link to CMC14 in &#8220;Recent Comments&#8221;.  Glad to see &#8220;My Favorite No&#8221; from the Teaching Channel in there.  That is one of my favorites for building a culture where incorrect steps can be useful.</p>
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		<title>
		By: George		</title>
		<link>/2014/teach-students-correct-but-useless-steps/#comment-2252919</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[George]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 19 Oct 2014 00:18:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21688#comment-2252919</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Incorrect is always useful for error analysis.  Students and learners should always be more interested in the problems they get wrong, because that&#039;s were there&#039;s learning to be done.  My students mistakes interest me because the often reveal common pitfalls, ambiguities, and confusions.  &quot;Why did I get that one wrong,&quot; should be a question posed with feelings of curiosity and determination, unfortunately it&#039;s too often accompanied with shame, frustration, and anxiety over &quot;being wrong&quot;.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Incorrect is always useful for error analysis.  Students and learners should always be more interested in the problems they get wrong, because that&#8217;s were there&#8217;s learning to be done.  My students mistakes interest me because the often reveal common pitfalls, ambiguities, and confusions.  &#8220;Why did I get that one wrong,&#8221; should be a question posed with feelings of curiosity and determination, unfortunately it&#8217;s too often accompanied with shame, frustration, and anxiety over &#8220;being wrong&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Chris Stephens		</title>
		<link>/2014/teach-students-correct-but-useless-steps/#comment-2248602</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chris Stephens]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Oct 2014 17:00:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21688#comment-2248602</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&quot;Incorrect but useful&quot; is actually my favorite of the four zones you mention. I think &quot;incorrect but useful&quot; is an area the mathematical problem-solver lives in a great deal of the time.

If you&#039;re only doing things that are both correct and useful, then you already knew how to solve that problem. That&#039;s fine, but it&#039;s not interesting.

If you&#039;re doing things that are neither useful nor correct, then I&#039;m not sure what you&#039;re doing (or even why).

If you&#039;re doing things that are correct but not useful, then you&#039;re generating trivia. Granted, this does happen sometimes in problem solving. The solver might think, &quot;I know this is legal, but I&#039;m not sure whether it helps...let&#039;s follow it for a bit and see if it turns into something useful.&quot; I personally find this to be more of a bland problem-solving process. It often works, but is more procedural than creative. 

But things that are useful but not correct--that&#039;s where creativity lies, in my experience. &quot;This is not true, but I wish it were; because if it were, then I could solve this problem like so... It&#039;s not true, but I wonder if some part of it is true? Or almost true? Or if something kind of like it is almost true in a partial way?...&quot;

The deliberate pursuit of statements that are useful but not correct can lead to beautiful, surprising solutions.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Incorrect but useful&#8221; is actually my favorite of the four zones you mention. I think &#8220;incorrect but useful&#8221; is an area the mathematical problem-solver lives in a great deal of the time.</p>
<p>If you&#8217;re only doing things that are both correct and useful, then you already knew how to solve that problem. That&#8217;s fine, but it&#8217;s not interesting.</p>
<p>If you&#8217;re doing things that are neither useful nor correct, then I&#8217;m not sure what you&#8217;re doing (or even why).</p>
<p>If you&#8217;re doing things that are correct but not useful, then you&#8217;re generating trivia. Granted, this does happen sometimes in problem solving. The solver might think, &#8220;I know this is legal, but I&#8217;m not sure whether it helps&#8230;let&#8217;s follow it for a bit and see if it turns into something useful.&#8221; I personally find this to be more of a bland problem-solving process. It often works, but is more procedural than creative. </p>
<p>But things that are useful but not correct&#8211;that&#8217;s where creativity lies, in my experience. &#8220;This is not true, but I wish it were; because if it were, then I could solve this problem like so&#8230; It&#8217;s not true, but I wonder if some part of it is true? Or almost true? Or if something kind of like it is almost true in a partial way?&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>The deliberate pursuit of statements that are useful but not correct can lead to beautiful, surprising solutions.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Barry Smith		</title>
		<link>/2014/teach-students-correct-but-useless-steps/#comment-2247054</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Barry Smith]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Oct 2014 09:40:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21688#comment-2247054</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Developing Pawan Kumar&#039;s response:  Euler could perform magic with his intuition.  Some of the things he did would be, by today&#039;s standards, totally non-rigorous, and some, when taken at face-value, are just incorrect.

The most popular example these days is surely his computation of values of divergent infinite series, like (4)-(7) here:

http://terrytao.wordpress.com/2010/04/10/the-euler-maclaurin-formula-bernoulli-numbers-the-zeta-function-and-real-variable-analytic-continuation/

These are the &quot;p-series&quot; from calculus with p=0, -1, -2, ... We learn in calculus class that p-series only converge with p&#062;1. The formulas are thus incorrect.

To see the utility, we can consider a function on (1,infinity) whose input is p and whose output is the sum of the convergent p-series.  This is the Riemann zeta function, and the formulas (4)-(7) suggest that it may be possible somehow to extend the definition of the function to non-positive numbers.  In fact, Euler did just that and found a remarkable &quot;functional equation&quot; satisfied by the function that makes the assignment of values (4)-(7) much more reasonable.

It seems most or all examples of &quot;incorrect but useful&quot; given herein concern either approximation or intuition.  A third category that might encompass or exceed both: examining incorrect deductions.  These can often lead to new useful definitions or theorems.  For instance, incorrect proofs of Fermat&#039;s Last Theorem use unique factorization in number systems that resemble the integer.  This leads to the idea that Unique Factorization is something that needs to be proved in such systems to be used.  Or in making calculus into the more rigorous &quot;real analysis&quot;, certain arguments lead to the notion of a &quot;uniform bound&quot; being needed in some statements (the &quot;epsilon&quot; used needs to be independent of other choices made ), leading to definitions like uniform convergence and uniform continuity.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Developing Pawan Kumar&#8217;s response:  Euler could perform magic with his intuition.  Some of the things he did would be, by today&#8217;s standards, totally non-rigorous, and some, when taken at face-value, are just incorrect.</p>
<p>The most popular example these days is surely his computation of values of divergent infinite series, like (4)-(7) here:</p>
<p><a href="http://terrytao.wordpress.com/2010/04/10/the-euler-maclaurin-formula-bernoulli-numbers-the-zeta-function-and-real-variable-analytic-continuation/" rel="nofollow ugc">http://terrytao.wordpress.com/2010/04/10/the-euler-maclaurin-formula-bernoulli-numbers-the-zeta-function-and-real-variable-analytic-continuation/</a></p>
<p>These are the &#8220;p-series&#8221; from calculus with p=0, -1, -2, &#8230; We learn in calculus class that p-series only converge with p&gt;1. The formulas are thus incorrect.</p>
<p>To see the utility, we can consider a function on (1,infinity) whose input is p and whose output is the sum of the convergent p-series.  This is the Riemann zeta function, and the formulas (4)-(7) suggest that it may be possible somehow to extend the definition of the function to non-positive numbers.  In fact, Euler did just that and found a remarkable &#8220;functional equation&#8221; satisfied by the function that makes the assignment of values (4)-(7) much more reasonable.</p>
<p>It seems most or all examples of &#8220;incorrect but useful&#8221; given herein concern either approximation or intuition.  A third category that might encompass or exceed both: examining incorrect deductions.  These can often lead to new useful definitions or theorems.  For instance, incorrect proofs of Fermat&#8217;s Last Theorem use unique factorization in number systems that resemble the integer.  This leads to the idea that Unique Factorization is something that needs to be proved in such systems to be used.  Or in making calculus into the more rigorous &#8220;real analysis&#8221;, certain arguments lead to the notion of a &#8220;uniform bound&#8221; being needed in some statements (the &#8220;epsilon&#8221; used needs to be independent of other choices made ), leading to definitions like uniform convergence and uniform continuity.</p>
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		<title>
		By: David Srebnick		</title>
		<link>/2014/teach-students-correct-but-useless-steps/#comment-2247026</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[David Srebnick]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Oct 2014 09:07:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21688#comment-2247026</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[to Bowen Kerins: I disagree with your assertion that your incorrect cancellations are useless.  The trick for 19/95 also works for 16/64, which could lead to some great number theory problems, like: are these the only two examples of these &quot;incorrect&quot; fraction cancellations that work for two digit numbers?  Can you find other examples or show that they don&#039;t exist?  If you work with three or four digit numbers, are there any such incorrect cancellations that produce a correct result?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>to Bowen Kerins: I disagree with your assertion that your incorrect cancellations are useless.  The trick for 19/95 also works for 16/64, which could lead to some great number theory problems, like: are these the only two examples of these &#8220;incorrect&#8221; fraction cancellations that work for two digit numbers?  Can you find other examples or show that they don&#8217;t exist?  If you work with three or four digit numbers, are there any such incorrect cancellations that produce a correct result?</p>
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		<title>
		By: Bowen Kerins		</title>
		<link>/2014/teach-students-correct-but-useless-steps/#comment-2246833</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Bowen Kerins]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Oct 2014 04:48:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21688#comment-2246833</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Incorrect but useful? (Neither of these mine.)

19 / 95, cancel out the 9s, leaving 1/5.

log(3x+2) + log(4x+1) = 2 log 11, cancel out the word &quot;log&quot; leaving (3x+2) + (4x+1) = 22, giving the correct answer.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Incorrect but useful? (Neither of these mine.)</p>
<p>19 / 95, cancel out the 9s, leaving 1/5.</p>
<p>log(3x+2) + log(4x+1) = 2 log 11, cancel out the word &#8220;log&#8221; leaving (3x+2) + (4x+1) = 22, giving the correct answer.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Annie Forest		</title>
		<link>/2014/teach-students-correct-but-useless-steps/#comment-2246421</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Annie Forest]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2014 18:30:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21688#comment-2246421</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Coming up with steps is similar to other &quot;tricks&quot; that we sometimes teach students (such as FOIL, cross multiplication, etc).  It happens with the best of intentions… we as teachers look for the patterns and organize what needs to be done and presents that information.  We try to make sense of what needs to be done and then pass along that understanding to the students.  The problem is that all the interesting work (looking for the patterns) is done by the teacher, not the students, so the steps seem to lack meaning and purpose.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Coming up with steps is similar to other &#8220;tricks&#8221; that we sometimes teach students (such as FOIL, cross multiplication, etc).  It happens with the best of intentions… we as teachers look for the patterns and organize what needs to be done and presents that information.  We try to make sense of what needs to be done and then pass along that understanding to the students.  The problem is that all the interesting work (looking for the patterns) is done by the teacher, not the students, so the steps seem to lack meaning and purpose.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sandra H		</title>
		<link>/2014/teach-students-correct-but-useless-steps/#comment-2245683</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sandra H]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2014 02:17:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21688#comment-2245683</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Incorrect but highly useful: Reductio ad Absurdum

In Geometry it is sometimes convenient to assume the negation of what you are trying to prove, then follow a logic chain until you reach a contradiction.
 
It is incorrect to assume that the square root of 2 is rational. But this leads to a logical inconsistency, enabling us to prove that the square root of 2 is irrational.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Incorrect but highly useful: Reductio ad Absurdum</p>
<p>In Geometry it is sometimes convenient to assume the negation of what you are trying to prove, then follow a logic chain until you reach a contradiction.</p>
<p>It is incorrect to assume that the square root of 2 is rational. But this leads to a logical inconsistency, enabling us to prove that the square root of 2 is irrational.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Systems of Equations: Elimination Method &#124; When Math Happens		</title>
		<link>/2014/teach-students-correct-but-useless-steps/#comment-2245030</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Systems of Equations: Elimination Method &#124; When Math Happens]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Oct 2014 14:24:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21688#comment-2245030</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[&#8230;] Teach Students Correct But Useless Steps (Dan Meyer) [&#8230;]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] Teach Students Correct But Useless Steps (Dan Meyer) [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>
		By: hunter		</title>
		<link>/2014/teach-students-correct-but-useless-steps/#comment-2244213</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[hunter]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Oct 2014 22:54:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21688#comment-2244213</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[To go with the systems example, I often ask S&#039;s what we should do next.  Even if what they say is &quot;wrong&quot; I follow through with the move and let them catch the mistake.  Either right then, or later on.  I have a question I always ask after we manipulate an equation: Did doing that help us, not change anything, or make things more complicated? -- In the long run I want them to see that we can do anything, as long as we maintain equality, but not everything is beneficial.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To go with the systems example, I often ask S&#8217;s what we should do next.  Even if what they say is &#8220;wrong&#8221; I follow through with the move and let them catch the mistake.  Either right then, or later on.  I have a question I always ask after we manipulate an equation: Did doing that help us, not change anything, or make things more complicated? &#8212; In the long run I want them to see that we can do anything, as long as we maintain equality, but not everything is beneficial.</p>
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