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	Comments on: We Should Wish PhotoMath All The Success In The World	</title>
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		By: Vise Review: PhotoMath; The App That Can Solve Math Sums... But Can It? &#124; TechVise		</title>
		<link>/2014/we-should-wish-photomath-all-the-success-in-the-world/#comment-2347675</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Vise Review: PhotoMath; The App That Can Solve Math Sums... But Can It? &#124; TechVise]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 17 Nov 2014 05:00:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21811#comment-2347675</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[&#8230;] example, certain blogsÂ and reviews have reported that PhotoMath provides blatantly wrong answers to math problems. There [&#8230;]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] example, certain blogsÂ and reviews have reported that PhotoMath provides blatantly wrong answers to math problems. There [&#8230;]</p>
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		By: Arriva PhotoMath, la app che risolve le equazioni &#124; Zanichelli Aula di scienze		</title>
		<link>/2014/we-should-wish-photomath-all-the-success-in-the-world/#comment-2315267</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Arriva PhotoMath, la app che risolve le equazioni &#124; Zanichelli Aula di scienze]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Nov 2014 07:00:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21811#comment-2315267</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[&#8230;] Â Immagine: Yahoo Tech via Dan Meyer [&#8230;]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] Â Immagine: Yahoo Tech via Dan Meyer [&#8230;]</p>
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		By: The App That Would End Math Homework -- Fusion		</title>
		<link>/2014/we-should-wish-photomath-all-the-success-in-the-world/#comment-2313708</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[The App That Would End Math Homework -- Fusion]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Nov 2014 16:40:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21811#comment-2313708</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[&#8230;] Mayer, a former math teacher and Stanford PhD student in math education, summarized this hope in a recent blog post about PhotoMath. &#8220;It’s conceivable PhotoMath could be great for problems with verbs like [&#8230;]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] Mayer, a former math teacher and Stanford PhD student in math education, summarized this hope in a recent blog post about PhotoMath. &#8220;It’s conceivable PhotoMath could be great for problems with verbs like [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>
		By: Sasa Skevin		</title>
		<link>/2014/we-should-wish-photomath-all-the-success-in-the-world/#comment-2281318</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sasa Skevin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Oct 2014 13:59:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21811#comment-2281318</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m part of PhotoMath dev team and would like to thank everyone for samples which didn&#039;t scan well. We welcome users to report bugs, send problems and give feedback. Our team will take everything into consideration and try to make PhotoMath more robust with less bugs and add new features over time.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m part of PhotoMath dev team and would like to thank everyone for samples which didn&#8217;t scan well. We welcome users to report bugs, send problems and give feedback. Our team will take everything into consideration and try to make PhotoMath more robust with less bugs and add new features over time.</p>
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		By: Michael Paul Goldenberg		</title>
		<link>/2014/we-should-wish-photomath-all-the-success-in-the-world/#comment-2278745</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Michael Paul Goldenberg]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Oct 2014 20:48:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21811#comment-2278745</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@Matt E.: I might agree with you if in fact the last 25-30 years hadn&#039;t shown that it goes just the opposite: the thoughtful stuff gets tossed; the computational stuff dominates. With the exception of classrooms taught by people like Dan Meyer and others who blog about their practice that reveal a great deal of deep thinking about math and teaching. 

PhotoMath is for the most part a gimmick that nonetheless highlights questions about technology vs. paper-and-pencil computational math. It barely touches, if at all, on what mathematicians do on a daily basis. And those whose work involves primarily loads of computations, particularly if large numbers are involved, are using technology extensively to probe further into what&#039;s out there. But of course they use the technology to pursue questions that no technology is going to ask or evaluate in the first place.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Matt E.: I might agree with you if in fact the last 25-30 years hadn&#8217;t shown that it goes just the opposite: the thoughtful stuff gets tossed; the computational stuff dominates. With the exception of classrooms taught by people like Dan Meyer and others who blog about their practice that reveal a great deal of deep thinking about math and teaching. </p>
<p>PhotoMath is for the most part a gimmick that nonetheless highlights questions about technology vs. paper-and-pencil computational math. It barely touches, if at all, on what mathematicians do on a daily basis. And those whose work involves primarily loads of computations, particularly if large numbers are involved, are using technology extensively to probe further into what&#8217;s out there. But of course they use the technology to pursue questions that no technology is going to ask or evaluate in the first place.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Matt E		</title>
		<link>/2014/we-should-wish-photomath-all-the-success-in-the-world/#comment-2278699</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Matt E]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Oct 2014 20:30:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21811#comment-2278699</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;Exercises as a means to an end of conceptual understanding of numbers and operations sounds great. That’s true even of basic computational exercises. Exercises as an end unto themselves is what I hope Hypothetical PhotoMath will undo.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
I&#039;m totally on board with that. My worry is that that&#039;s a fine distinction, and that the false dichotomy of &quot;computation bad, concepts good&quot; may mean that the baby gets thrown out with the bathwater.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Exercises as a means to an end of conceptual understanding of numbers and operations sounds great. That’s true even of basic computational exercises. Exercises as an end unto themselves is what I hope Hypothetical PhotoMath will undo.</p></blockquote>
<p>I&#8217;m totally on board with that. My worry is that that&#8217;s a fine distinction, and that the false dichotomy of &#8220;computation bad, concepts good&#8221; may mean that the baby gets thrown out with the bathwater.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Reading Assignment 10/26 &#124; Multiple Factors		</title>
		<link>/2014/we-should-wish-photomath-all-the-success-in-the-world/#comment-2277887</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Reading Assignment 10/26 &#124; Multiple Factors]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Oct 2014 15:43:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21811#comment-2277887</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[&#8230;] We Should Wish PhotoMath all the Success in the World  THIS. [&#8230;]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] We Should Wish PhotoMath all the Success in the World  THIS. [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>
		By: Dan Meyer		</title>
		<link>/2014/we-should-wish-photomath-all-the-success-in-the-world/#comment-2274421</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan Meyer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Oct 2014 18:04:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21811#comment-2274421</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@&lt;strong&gt;Matt E&lt;/strong&gt;, thanks for coming back by and updating us.

&lt;blockquote&gt;All I ask is that those heralding PhotoMath and all of its siblings and eventual descendants just take a minute to try to imagine what these new technologies might undo.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Again, I &lt;em&gt;do&lt;/em&gt; imagine what they might undo and I hope for it.

But I think &lt;strong&gt;M Ruppell&lt;/strong&gt; and &lt;strong&gt;Michael Pershan&lt;/strong&gt; have helped me see my final kiss-off to problems that Hypothetical-PhotoMath-That-Doesn&#039;t-Suck can do was too strong. Exercises as a means to an end of conceptual understanding of numbers and operations sounds great. That&#039;s true even of basic computational exercises. Exercises as an end unto themselves is what I hope Hypothetical PhotoMath will undo.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@<strong>Matt E</strong>, thanks for coming back by and updating us.</p>
<blockquote><p>All I ask is that those heralding PhotoMath and all of its siblings and eventual descendants just take a minute to try to imagine what these new technologies might undo.</p></blockquote>
<p>Again, I <em>do</em> imagine what they might undo and I hope for it.</p>
<p>But I think <strong>M Ruppell</strong> and <strong>Michael Pershan</strong> have helped me see my final kiss-off to problems that Hypothetical-PhotoMath-That-Doesn&#8217;t-Suck can do was too strong. Exercises as a means to an end of conceptual understanding of numbers and operations sounds great. That&#8217;s true even of basic computational exercises. Exercises as an end unto themselves is what I hope Hypothetical PhotoMath will undo.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Kenneth Tilton		</title>
		<link>/2014/we-should-wish-photomath-all-the-success-in-the-world/#comment-2273905</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Kenneth Tilton]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Oct 2014 14:55:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21811#comment-2273905</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@MattE I remember when I was learning Algebra and doing 15-20 homework problems and sometimes I would spot a shortcut that turned out to be the next day&#039;s lesson. I always thought I had discovered something. :)

Lots of quotes favoring practice here: http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/tag/practice

This one is short and sweet: “For the things we have to learn before we can do them, we learn by doing them.” â€• Aristotle, The Nicomachean Ethics

The thing about sufficient (not excessive) practice is that there is a difference between consciously knowing something like the distributive property and having internalized it through practice. The latter is necessary to perform at a higher level where the skill is taken for granted, and indeed I think that is what we mean by learning.

Anything hard we can do requires us first to do in our sleep what goes into it. Successful hockey players do not think much about how to skate, i like to say.

Conrad Wolfram discusses the issues in great depth here http://www.ted.com/talks/conrad_wolfram_teaching_kids_real_math_with_computers?language=en, coming down in favor of using computers wherever possible (except for number facts).

Of course he sells a product that does Algebra for us and I sell a product that helps us learn to do Algebra ourselves, so no surprise on our disagreement. :)]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@MattE I remember when I was learning Algebra and doing 15-20 homework problems and sometimes I would spot a shortcut that turned out to be the next day&#8217;s lesson. I always thought I had discovered something. :)</p>
<p>Lots of quotes favoring practice here: <a href="http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/tag/practice" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/tag/practice</a></p>
<p>This one is short and sweet: “For the things we have to learn before we can do them, we learn by doing them.” â€• Aristotle, The Nicomachean Ethics</p>
<p>The thing about sufficient (not excessive) practice is that there is a difference between consciously knowing something like the distributive property and having internalized it through practice. The latter is necessary to perform at a higher level where the skill is taken for granted, and indeed I think that is what we mean by learning.</p>
<p>Anything hard we can do requires us first to do in our sleep what goes into it. Successful hockey players do not think much about how to skate, i like to say.</p>
<p>Conrad Wolfram discusses the issues in great depth here <a href="http://www.ted.com/talks/conrad_wolfram_teaching_kids_real_math_with_computers?language=en" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.ted.com/talks/conrad_wolfram_teaching_kids_real_math_with_computers?language=en</a>, coming down in favor of using computers wherever possible (except for number facts).</p>
<p>Of course he sells a product that does Algebra for us and I sell a product that helps us learn to do Algebra ourselves, so no surprise on our disagreement. :)</p>
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		<title>
		By: Matt E		</title>
		<link>/2014/we-should-wish-photomath-all-the-success-in-the-world/#comment-2273776</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Matt E]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Oct 2014 13:51:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=21811#comment-2273776</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I&#039;ve been ruminating on this for a few days now. What&#039;s frustrating to me is that I feel I&#039;m being lumped into the category of teachers who &quot;like teaching all the dull, mindless arithmetic and algebra.&quot; I don&#039;t like teaching anything that is dull and mindless. I guess my main argument is that there is value in repeated calculation--not for its own sake, but for the sake of having students discover patterns, relationships, and shortcuts on their own.

I am about to start a section in my Discrete Math class on graph coloring and chromatic numbers. I am presenting my students with around 20 &quot;blank&quot; graphs, and having them try to figure out on their own what the chromatic number of each graph is. I imagine that, five years down the road, they&#039;ll be able to snap a picture of a graph and have an app determine the chromatic number. So why should I make my students &quot;suffer&quot; and try to figure it out on their own? Because I hope to have them try to give words to any patterns or rules they are noticing, so that we can write them down, organize them, debate them, and maybe prove them. That is doing math. That is why I don&#039;t want them to &quot;just Google it&quot; or &quot;just [insert spiffy new app] it&quot;. Then again, these are conversations I have with my students regularly. I ask my Advanced Topics students to not use calculators or computers unless they get expressed permission from me. Obviously I have no control over what they do outside of class (or even inside it), but once they understand my motives, they are amenable.

I&#039;m a big fan of this quote from Neil Postman (in &lt;i&gt;Technopoly&lt;/i&gt;):
&lt;blockquote&gt;We are currently surrounded by one-eyed prophets who see only what new technologies can &lt;i&gt;do&lt;/i&gt; and are incapable of imagining what they will &lt;i&gt;undo&lt;/i&gt;.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

All I ask is that those heralding PhotoMath and all of its siblings and eventual descendants just take a &lt;i&gt;minute&lt;/i&gt; to try to imagine what these new technologies might &lt;i&gt;undo&lt;/i&gt;.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve been ruminating on this for a few days now. What&#8217;s frustrating to me is that I feel I&#8217;m being lumped into the category of teachers who &#8220;like teaching all the dull, mindless arithmetic and algebra.&#8221; I don&#8217;t like teaching anything that is dull and mindless. I guess my main argument is that there is value in repeated calculation&#8211;not for its own sake, but for the sake of having students discover patterns, relationships, and shortcuts on their own.</p>
<p>I am about to start a section in my Discrete Math class on graph coloring and chromatic numbers. I am presenting my students with around 20 &#8220;blank&#8221; graphs, and having them try to figure out on their own what the chromatic number of each graph is. I imagine that, five years down the road, they&#8217;ll be able to snap a picture of a graph and have an app determine the chromatic number. So why should I make my students &#8220;suffer&#8221; and try to figure it out on their own? Because I hope to have them try to give words to any patterns or rules they are noticing, so that we can write them down, organize them, debate them, and maybe prove them. That is doing math. That is why I don&#8217;t want them to &#8220;just Google it&#8221; or &#8220;just [insert spiffy new app] it&#8221;. Then again, these are conversations I have with my students regularly. I ask my Advanced Topics students to not use calculators or computers unless they get expressed permission from me. Obviously I have no control over what they do outside of class (or even inside it), but once they understand my motives, they are amenable.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m a big fan of this quote from Neil Postman (in <i>Technopoly</i>):</p>
<blockquote><p>We are currently surrounded by one-eyed prophets who see only what new technologies can <i>do</i> and are incapable of imagining what they will <i>undo</i>.</p></blockquote>
<p>All I ask is that those heralding PhotoMath and all of its siblings and eventual descendants just take a <i>minute</i> to try to imagine what these new technologies might <i>undo</i>.</p>
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