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	Comments on: How Do You Make A MTBOS?	</title>
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	<description>less helpful</description>
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		<title>
		By: Judy Larsen		</title>
		<link>/2016/how-do-you-make-a-mtbos/#comment-2422646</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Judy Larsen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Jun 2016 21:11:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=24415#comment-2422646</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[You&#039;ve basically hit my research question =) . . . a tough one for sure! At this point, I think it has to be studied as a collective phenomenon rather than from the perspective of individuals. This collective is by far the most productive and creative body I have ever experienced!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;ve basically hit my research question =) . . . a tough one for sure! At this point, I think it has to be studied as a collective phenomenon rather than from the perspective of individuals. This collective is by far the most productive and creative body I have ever experienced!</p>
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		By: Suzanne Alejandre		</title>
		<link>/2016/how-do-you-make-a-mtbos/#comment-2418020</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Suzanne Alejandre]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Feb 2016 16:54:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=24415#comment-2418020</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Dan, your questions about math-teach prompted quite an internal exchange within the Math Forum staff!

Yes, our discussion staff have tried valiantly to moderate it since 2007 and have taken many slings and arrows from all sides since then and feel great disappointment in the result. We all feel your pain. 

Here’s a little of the history – math-teach began as nctm-l. As the Math Wars picked up steam, and the Internet world was a much smaller, more focused place, this discussion group has been the home of unpleasant argument ever since. The Math Forum agreed to take over hosting in 1995 I think (which was the year that I attended my first Math Forum Summer Institute! I was still a middle school computer and math teacher at that point. I joined the staff in June, 2000). 

Eventually NCTM was no longer willing to be associated with it and thus, the renaming. It might be significant that such forums are meant to be open, public spaces, and centralized rather than dispersed. For our part we focused on other venues for productive conversation and online math interaction, and other more focused discussion groups were established as well, including
    Ask Dr. Math: http://mathforum.org/dr.math/
    Math Tools: http://mathforum.org/mathtools/
    Teacher2Teacher (T2T): http://mathforum.org/t2t/
    pow-teach: http://mathforum.org/kb/forum.jspa?forumID=375
    ap-stat and ap-calc until they moved over to the College Board site
    professional organizations: http://mathforum.org/kb/forumcategory.jspa?categoryID=17

In a sense, we have left math-teach as a space for those who want that sort of interaction, hoping to minimize their interest in fouling the other places we do our work.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dan, your questions about math-teach prompted quite an internal exchange within the Math Forum staff!</p>
<p>Yes, our discussion staff have tried valiantly to moderate it since 2007 and have taken many slings and arrows from all sides since then and feel great disappointment in the result. We all feel your pain. </p>
<p>Here’s a little of the history – math-teach began as nctm-l. As the Math Wars picked up steam, and the Internet world was a much smaller, more focused place, this discussion group has been the home of unpleasant argument ever since. The Math Forum agreed to take over hosting in 1995 I think (which was the year that I attended my first Math Forum Summer Institute! I was still a middle school computer and math teacher at that point. I joined the staff in June, 2000). </p>
<p>Eventually NCTM was no longer willing to be associated with it and thus, the renaming. It might be significant that such forums are meant to be open, public spaces, and centralized rather than dispersed. For our part we focused on other venues for productive conversation and online math interaction, and other more focused discussion groups were established as well, including<br />
    Ask Dr. Math: <a href="http://mathforum.org/dr.math/" rel="nofollow ugc">http://mathforum.org/dr.math/</a><br />
    Math Tools: <a href="http://mathforum.org/mathtools/" rel="nofollow ugc">http://mathforum.org/mathtools/</a><br />
    Teacher2Teacher (T2T): <a href="http://mathforum.org/t2t/" rel="nofollow ugc">http://mathforum.org/t2t/</a><br />
    pow-teach: <a href="http://mathforum.org/kb/forum.jspa?forumID=375" rel="nofollow ugc">http://mathforum.org/kb/forum.jspa?forumID=375</a><br />
    ap-stat and ap-calc until they moved over to the College Board site<br />
    professional organizations: <a href="http://mathforum.org/kb/forumcategory.jspa?categoryID=17" rel="nofollow ugc">http://mathforum.org/kb/forumcategory.jspa?categoryID=17</a></p>
<p>In a sense, we have left math-teach as a space for those who want that sort of interaction, hoping to minimize their interest in fouling the other places we do our work.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Dan Meyer		</title>
		<link>/2016/how-do-you-make-a-mtbos/#comment-2417837</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan Meyer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2016 22:01:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=24415#comment-2417837</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;strong&gt;Suzanne&lt;/strong&gt;:

&lt;blockquote&gt;As I re-read, I’m thinking that it’s really “math-teach” that is the angry place that makes you sad when you visit it. Or, at least, that’s what I’m hoping.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Yes, just &quot;math-teach.&quot;

&lt;blockquote&gt;One way that we serve the community is to provide places/opportunities for conversations. Math-teach is one of those places. I wonder what might be done so that it isn’t an angry place. Do you or others have ideas?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I&#039;m curious if there is any moderation at all. Is there a code of conduct? Are people just allowed to say anything at all to each other?  Here&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://mathforum.org/kb/message.jspa?messageID=9782277&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;a thread at random&lt;/a&gt; where people are just &lt;em&gt;hacking&lt;/em&gt; away at each other.

My blog is hardly a perfect forum, but what civility we have here has come as a result of a) promoting helpful commenters, b) nagging unhelpful commenters, c) deleting really unhelpful commenters, d) blocking really, really unhelpful commenters. Math-teach just seems like a free-for-all and I&#039;m wondering if similar efforts have been made to moderate it.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Suzanne</strong>:</p>
<blockquote><p>As I re-read, I’m thinking that it’s really “math-teach” that is the angry place that makes you sad when you visit it. Or, at least, that’s what I’m hoping.</p></blockquote>
<p>Yes, just &#8220;math-teach.&#8221;</p>
<blockquote><p>One way that we serve the community is to provide places/opportunities for conversations. Math-teach is one of those places. I wonder what might be done so that it isn’t an angry place. Do you or others have ideas?</p></blockquote>
<p>I&#8217;m curious if there is any moderation at all. Is there a code of conduct? Are people just allowed to say anything at all to each other?  Here&#8217;s <a href="http://mathforum.org/kb/message.jspa?messageID=9782277" rel="nofollow">a thread at random</a> where people are just <em>hacking</em> away at each other.</p>
<p>My blog is hardly a perfect forum, but what civility we have here has come as a result of a) promoting helpful commenters, b) nagging unhelpful commenters, c) deleting really unhelpful commenters, d) blocking really, really unhelpful commenters. Math-teach just seems like a free-for-all and I&#8217;m wondering if similar efforts have been made to moderate it.</p>
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		By: Kara Tobey		</title>
		<link>/2016/how-do-you-make-a-mtbos/#comment-2417793</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Kara Tobey]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2016 03:56:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=24415#comment-2417793</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I had a lot of ideas about teaching math better, but very few resources and stumbled onto the MTBOS in a desperate search for  lesson plans. I keep returning because when I attempt to implement ideas I&#039;ve found here (however imperfectly) my students respond to it, and I&#039;m watching their attitudes toward math change (slooooowly), and it makes my job way more enjoyable. So that has kept me hungry to learn more and find better lessons and share my own experiences. There&#039;s no way I can go back to the traditional format, and I don&#039;t know near enough to keep teaching this way without all the help I find on the MTBOS.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I had a lot of ideas about teaching math better, but very few resources and stumbled onto the MTBOS in a desperate search for  lesson plans. I keep returning because when I attempt to implement ideas I&#8217;ve found here (however imperfectly) my students respond to it, and I&#8217;m watching their attitudes toward math change (slooooowly), and it makes my job way more enjoyable. So that has kept me hungry to learn more and find better lessons and share my own experiences. There&#8217;s no way I can go back to the traditional format, and I don&#8217;t know near enough to keep teaching this way without all the help I find on the MTBOS.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Suzanne Alejandre		</title>
		<link>/2016/how-do-you-make-a-mtbos/#comment-2417773</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Suzanne Alejandre]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Feb 2016 17:38:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=24415#comment-2417773</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I confess, Dan, that as I quickly read your response to Annie it seems that you are saying that the 2016 version of the Math Forum is an angry place and that you&#039;re sad when you visit us. As you might imagine, that hurt my heart.

As I re-read, I&#039;m thinking that it&#039;s really &quot;math-teach&quot; that is the angry place that makes you sad when you visit it. Or, at least, that&#039;s what I&#039;m hoping.

The 1992 version (when it was the Geometry Forum) was founded on the idea of offering &quot;an online math education community center.&quot; We have continued that mission for 24 years nows (although, we&#039;ve had a bit of a hiccup since the staff left Drexel on June 30th but all of the legal paperwork we hope will be signed soon. We are so excited to be part of NCTM!). 

One way that we serve the community is to provide places/opportunities for conversations. Math-teach is one of those places. I wonder what might be done so that it isn&#039;t an angry place. Do you or others have ideas?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I confess, Dan, that as I quickly read your response to Annie it seems that you are saying that the 2016 version of the Math Forum is an angry place and that you&#8217;re sad when you visit us. As you might imagine, that hurt my heart.</p>
<p>As I re-read, I&#8217;m thinking that it&#8217;s really &#8220;math-teach&#8221; that is the angry place that makes you sad when you visit it. Or, at least, that&#8217;s what I&#8217;m hoping.</p>
<p>The 1992 version (when it was the Geometry Forum) was founded on the idea of offering &#8220;an online math education community center.&#8221; We have continued that mission for 24 years nows (although, we&#8217;ve had a bit of a hiccup since the staff left Drexel on June 30th but all of the legal paperwork we hope will be signed soon. We are so excited to be part of NCTM!). </p>
<p>One way that we serve the community is to provide places/opportunities for conversations. Math-teach is one of those places. I wonder what might be done so that it isn&#8217;t an angry place. Do you or others have ideas?</p>
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		By: Dan Meyer		</title>
		<link>/2016/how-do-you-make-a-mtbos/#comment-2417751</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan Meyer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Feb 2016 23:38:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=24415#comment-2417751</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I wish I knew the 1992 version of the Math Forum. The 2016 version —Â or at least its &quot;math-teach&quot; sub-forum — is such an angry place and I&#039;m always sadder for having visited. How did that happen?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wish I knew the 1992 version of the Math Forum. The 2016 version —Â or at least its &#8220;math-teach&#8221; sub-forum — is such an angry place and I&#8217;m always sadder for having visited. How did that happen?</p>
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		<title>
		By: Annie Fetter		</title>
		<link>/2016/how-do-you-make-a-mtbos/#comment-2417750</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Annie Fetter]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Feb 2016 23:18:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=24415#comment-2417750</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m a bit late to the party, but would like to float the idea that one possible factor in the existence of the MTBoS is that the Math Forum has been around as an online math teacher community since 1992.  I&#039;m not an anthropologist or sociologist (though we have one who writes about the Math Forum), but hard to believe there isn&#039;t some connection.

For those who only know us as folks who tweet and run Ignite events, you might check out this informal history I wrote after participating in a panel convened by Lani Horn: http://mathforum.org/blogs/annie/2014/05/07/the-math-forum-the-original-social-network-for-math-teachers/]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m a bit late to the party, but would like to float the idea that one possible factor in the existence of the MTBoS is that the Math Forum has been around as an online math teacher community since 1992.  I&#8217;m not an anthropologist or sociologist (though we have one who writes about the Math Forum), but hard to believe there isn&#8217;t some connection.</p>
<p>For those who only know us as folks who tweet and run Ignite events, you might check out this informal history I wrote after participating in a panel convened by Lani Horn: <a href="http://mathforum.org/blogs/annie/2014/05/07/the-math-forum-the-original-social-network-for-math-teachers/" rel="nofollow ugc">http://mathforum.org/blogs/annie/2014/05/07/the-math-forum-the-original-social-network-for-math-teachers/</a></p>
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		<title>
		By: Kevin Hall		</title>
		<link>/2016/how-do-you-make-a-mtbos/#comment-2417680</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Kevin Hall]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 17 Feb 2016 15:11:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=24415#comment-2417680</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Wanted to chime in on &quot;rock stars&quot;.  For me, it actually has been critical that we&#039;ve had some major opinion leaders such as Dan, Sam Shah, Kate Nowak, etc.  What I get out of the MTBoS is the chance to have a years-long running conversation with some folks, particularly Dan.  Those types of conversations can&#039;t happen when you&#039;re just commenting on boards with lots of random teachers, because you spend 80% of the time explaining your philosophical/empirical priors before you get to the matter at hand.  With you, I can just skip that, and I can also read your posts and replies without having to ask you where you&#039;re coming from.  It&#039;s a million times more interesting and challenging than chatting with folks I don&#039;t know.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wanted to chime in on &#8220;rock stars&#8221;.  For me, it actually has been critical that we&#8217;ve had some major opinion leaders such as Dan, Sam Shah, Kate Nowak, etc.  What I get out of the MTBoS is the chance to have a years-long running conversation with some folks, particularly Dan.  Those types of conversations can&#8217;t happen when you&#8217;re just commenting on boards with lots of random teachers, because you spend 80% of the time explaining your philosophical/empirical priors before you get to the matter at hand.  With you, I can just skip that, and I can also read your posts and replies without having to ask you where you&#8217;re coming from.  It&#8217;s a million times more interesting and challenging than chatting with folks I don&#8217;t know.</p>
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		By: Dan Meyer		</title>
		<link>/2016/how-do-you-make-a-mtbos/#comment-2417672</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan Meyer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Feb 2016 17:41:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=24415#comment-2417672</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[&lt;strong&gt;David Wees&lt;/strong&gt;:

&lt;blockquote&gt;I wonder if one reason we have such a wide variety in responses to your question is that we are attempting to find a causal relationship where none might exist?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I&#039;m actually very surprised by the &lt;em&gt;narrow&lt;/em&gt; range of reasons for participation. Both here and on Twitter, people have cited community, encouragement, and support far above any other reason. The second place finisher —Â resources —Â doesn&#039;t seem close to me. Your read is different?

&lt;blockquote&gt;Is it possible that this is not true with other online platforms? For example, could ELA communities exist with greater depth than the equivalent math ed communities on Facebook?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Certainly they could. I&#039;d be grateful for examples.

It&#039;s interesting to me that the #MTBOS isn&#039;t limited to T&#039;s and B&#039;s, though. What began on blogs expanded to Twitter and then to webinar platforms and then to an email newsletter and then to a physical conference.

I&#039;ll bet we could find a thriving Pinterest community of ELA educators. But could we find them in &lt;em&gt;all&lt;/em&gt; of those media?

&lt;strong&gt;Henri&lt;/strong&gt;:

&lt;blockquote&gt;Yet another hypothesis: could it be that one contributing factor is the participation of a math ed rock star? Do other disciplines have their Dan Meyer equivalents?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Perish the thought ...]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>David Wees</strong>:</p>
<blockquote><p>I wonder if one reason we have such a wide variety in responses to your question is that we are attempting to find a causal relationship where none might exist?</p></blockquote>
<p>I&#8217;m actually very surprised by the <em>narrow</em> range of reasons for participation. Both here and on Twitter, people have cited community, encouragement, and support far above any other reason. The second place finisher —Â resources —Â doesn&#8217;t seem close to me. Your read is different?</p>
<blockquote><p>Is it possible that this is not true with other online platforms? For example, could ELA communities exist with greater depth than the equivalent math ed communities on Facebook?</p></blockquote>
<p>Certainly they could. I&#8217;d be grateful for examples.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s interesting to me that the #MTBOS isn&#8217;t limited to T&#8217;s and B&#8217;s, though. What began on blogs expanded to Twitter and then to webinar platforms and then to an email newsletter and then to a physical conference.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll bet we could find a thriving Pinterest community of ELA educators. But could we find them in <em>all</em> of those media?</p>
<p><strong>Henri</strong>:</p>
<blockquote><p>Yet another hypothesis: could it be that one contributing factor is the participation of a math ed rock star? Do other disciplines have their Dan Meyer equivalents?</p></blockquote>
<p>Perish the thought &#8230;</p>
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		By: Henri Picciotto		</title>
		<link>/2016/how-do-you-make-a-mtbos/#comment-2417671</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Henri Picciotto]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Feb 2016 17:38:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=24415#comment-2417671</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Yet another hypothesis: could it be that one contributing factor is the participation of a math ed rock star? Do other disciplines have their Dan Meyer equivalents?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yet another hypothesis: could it be that one contributing factor is the participation of a math ed rock star? Do other disciplines have their Dan Meyer equivalents?</p>
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